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Post by joemegmom on Mar 11, 2006 20:28:25 GMT -5
Catatonic, What do you think about the nordic naturasl EPA..in two gels they have 850 EPA and 200 DHA...would this be better for my 42 pound son ( he is taking the nordic naturals 3-6-9 Jr. at the present)...also do I need a supplement of vitamin E...the nordic naturals EPA has 30 IU and the 3-6-9 jr has 13 Iu he is also taking adderall that I hope to stop at spring break
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Post by catatonic on Mar 12, 2006 0:48:19 GMT -5
I think all of the Nordic Naturals products are good quality. They're pharmaceutical grade, and use independent lab verification to guarantee the purity of their product.
The Omega 3-6-9 has the advantage of containing GLA, so that you wouldn't need a separate Evening Primrose Oil capsule with it. However, to achieve a therapeutic dose, you need to give your son 10 of them per day.
The EPA requires only 5 capsules, so even with a separate EPO, you're still taking fewer pills.
Neither contains enough Vitamin E. You need to provide 100 - 400iu daily.
Unfortuantely, my son has a negative reaction to all of the Nordic Naturals products. I believe it's the lemon and rosemary flavorings. They're all natural, but for some reason my son can't tolerate them. Hopefully this won't be a problem for you, but it is something to watch for.
It requires 8 - 12 weeks to correct an Omega-3 deficiency. While you may see results far sooner than this -- for us it required about 6 weeks -- don't expect the same kind of immediate response that you see with medication.
How has the adderall worked out for you?
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Post by joemegmom on Mar 12, 2006 7:08:29 GMT -5
The adderall works wonderfully for focus...my son is now completing ALL of his work and even homework without much fuss...he is still impulsive and calls out in class and can be outspoken... the doc thinks that some of this impulsive behavior will go away as he gets older...and agreed that we need to deal with it in a behavioral manner rather than more meds or increased meds
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Post by joemegmom on Mar 12, 2006 7:53:33 GMT -5
Cat, do you think that a magnesium supplement in addition to the omega 3s would help with his calling out?
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Post by joemegmom on Mar 12, 2006 7:55:21 GMT -5
Cat, do you think that a magnesium supplement in addition to the omega 3s would help with his calling out? BTW Thanks so much for your info...you are amazing
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 12, 2006 9:16:55 GMT -5
joemegmom, what do you mean by calling out? Just calling out the answers without waiting or calling out strange noises at inappropriate times?
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Post by joemegmom on Mar 12, 2006 9:51:20 GMT -5
maining calling out the answers without waiting..not strange noises, this happens usually during group discussions
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Post by catatonic on Mar 12, 2006 10:30:21 GMT -5
No secret that I'm a big proponent of magnesium supplementation. Every ADHD kid ought to be on nice big amounts of it. It's essential for optimum brain function, and is particularly useful in controlling neutransmission and reducing excitatory messages.
I think that magnesium helps with impulse control in general, and the calling out behavior is probably related to impulsiveness.
With my son, it's chatting to the other kids that gets him in trouble...he just can't resist sharing his wit with those around him. He's improved significantly thanks to supplements/diet, but I honestly think that it's who he is and short of sedating him into unconsciousness, the biggest factor in him getting it under control is going to be maturity. Learning not to yell out answers without being called on by the teacher is a skill that's not too difficult to acquire as long as the classroom is pretty controlled...but those group discussions where everyone is eager to contribute are difficult. My son gets excited and out-of-control without clear structure to regulate him. The magnesium and fish oil help a lot, but the underlying tendency is still there. Unfortunately.
Take a look at the magnesium thread for suggestions on type and dose. Basic guidelines are to avoid magnesium oxide, and to multiply body weight times 3 to calculate minimum -- or maintenance -- dose. Twice that amount is therapeutic dose.
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Post by 2kids on Mar 13, 2006 12:49:04 GMT -5
Hey everyone~~~ I have my 9 yr old dau on omega3 mood by country life epa 1000mg DHA 200mg vit E in the omegas is 20 IU. I was giving a multi vit with it the gummy ones but we ran out and I wanted to give her a better quality. Then I gave her my older dau teen multi that went well for a bit until she had trouble swallowing that, she can swallow the omegas no problem since they have such a smooth coating!!!
Any way Its been almost 3months since I started giving her them on Jan 2nd. I havent seen much improvment in fact her cognitive therapist has said she feels I might want to look into meds because she has to redirect her and she should not be making the mistakes she is at this point. She feels it is holding her back and she's at a stand still in the program. She is working on tracking and strenthing eye muscles as a last resort. She doesnt know that I have her on omegas. Do I need to give it more time or am I doing something wrong?? I do also notice food does effect her I read someones post about that and I do believe food is an important factor. One day she had sour patch kids candy(which she loves) and it effected her behavior when she went in for tutoring. It was a great learning expeirance for her because she noticed the difference herself therefore it will be easier to say well maybe we should skip that since the last time you didnt feel well when you ate it. It's very hard to take all the things they love away when they dont understand why!!
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Post by catatonic on Mar 13, 2006 14:48:23 GMT -5
I like the OMega-3 Mood formula. It's a good product. If you're giving her 2 capsules a day at this point, you aren't giving her enough. You need to give her at least 4 capsules, and 5 would be even better. Your goal is to provide 480mg DHA and at least twice as much EPA. You've got plenty of EPA in there, it's just the DHA you need to boost. And it doesn't contain enough Vitamin E. Check the multi. Between her multi and what's in the Omega-3 Mood, she needs to get at least 100iu, up to as much as 400iu. Normally 3 months would be plenty of time to see effects from fish oil supplementation, but with the low amount of DHA she's getting, it's possible it just isn't enough. See what happens over several weeks at the higher amount. We're extremely careful about diet. The Feingold diet has been really miraculous for my son, with the added elimination of corn syrup. His acting-out type behaviors are very well controlled, leaving only his attentiveness as an issue. That's where supplements have helped. It is hard to give up foods that everyone else is eating and that are advertised all over television. I try to substitute healthy junk food options so my kids don't feel too deprived, and with the youngest who has been eating nothing but Feingold approved food since she started eating real food, it's not a problem at all. Unfortunately, my ADHD son has the hardest time with it and tends to sneak when the opportunity presents itself (he can't resist those donuts at band practice). Then we all pay the price because he's IMPOSSIBLE. At least it's easy to keep him away from artificial colors -- they give him migraines, and if you've ever had a migraine, you know you'll do anything you have to in order to avoid ever getting another one.
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Post by 2kids on Mar 14, 2006 10:12:16 GMT -5
On the bottle of the mood it say kids 1 capsule and adults 2?? so I have been giving her 1. I did try 2 and noticed she was wired so I went back to 1>> Should I be giving her something eles or adding a different thing?? The food Im working on. It is so very hard because she loves certain food and can be picky. Not so bad as her friends though> Thank God because I have to order in everytime they eat over!!That picky!! I think she is reconizing her behavior on certain foods and Im grateful for that!! I can just say that might not be a good choice for before school because~~~ She had roman noodles at her friends on Sunday and that has msg in it. I cant seem to keep her away from that. I tried to add chicken brth to the noodles and she didnt like it. Everytime I reread these posts I get something new from them and get one step closer to what she needs so thank you!! Im taking steps and it seems to be working to hopefully get closer to our goal. I
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Post by catatonic on Mar 14, 2006 11:15:16 GMT -5
If you tried 2 and she seemed wired, then stick with one. What you can do is get something like the Now brand DHA-250 capsules and add one of those to see how it goes. They're small, and one will provide an additional 250mg DHA, but only 100mg extra EPA. www.iherb.com/dha2.html
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Post by 2kids on Mar 15, 2006 10:47:28 GMT -5
Thanks catatonic~~ What do you think about maybe giving 1 cap in the AM and one in the pm of the omega mood?? Maybe it wouldnt effect her so much.
I just found some cans of soup in the store thats organic. She loves tomatoe soup but when I read the lable it had corn syrup so this one had cane juice which I read is better. Little by little Im getting it!! My 12 yr old is getting annoyed she keeps saying "Oh here she goes again with this organic junk" LOL
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Post by ambersmom on Mar 15, 2006 23:07:25 GMT -5
2kids, Thats exactly how my 13 year old is acting...oh mom not organic..but my 7 year old will tell everyone that shes on a organic diet and go on and on about its good for you. i just dont buy the things i dont want him to have but im sure hes sneaking it at school.
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Post by catatonic on Mar 16, 2006 10:32:37 GMT -5
My kids call me the Food Nazi. On the other hand, they're always dragging their friends over to eat homemade bread and goodies and meals, and tell them about MGS killing their brains and how regular milk is loaded with pus and hormones and antibiotics. They like eating organic, but it's not cool to admit it.
My ADHD son (11yo) sneaks food at school, too. No idea how to get him to stop. Maybe when he matures a little, he won't be so worried about being different and he'll knock it off.
ambersmom, I think trying one in the am and one in the pm is a good idea. Maybe spreading it out a little will help.
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Post by 2kids on Mar 22, 2006 13:24:05 GMT -5
It looks like I might have to start on meds!! The cognitive therapist had a long talk with me and said she used to work with I think she said a neuroligist and actually tested kids for ADD and she said my dau has it. She said it will be a moral call soon to stop treating her in her reading therapy because she's at a stand still and her attention is getting in the way>> I called my pediatrician and she wants her to see a phycologist before she will treat her! Im a bit sad today!! Im still giving her the omegas with 200 mg vit E>>
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nde
Full Member
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Post by nde on Mar 22, 2006 16:55:42 GMT -5
Hi,
I have been giving my son the nordic naturals liquid omega 3's--the lemon flavored one for about 4-5 weeks. My question is, if I smell the oil, is it supposed to smell fishy? The last bottle I got I don't remember it smelling so fishy. If its not good, I guess I can bring it back to the health food store I bought it at. Does anyone have this problem when purchasing oil from the internet?
Thanks, Natalie
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 22, 2006 17:49:45 GMT -5
It looks like I might have to start on meds!! The cognitive therapist had a long talk with me and said she used to work with I think she said a neuroligist and actually tested kids for ADD and she said my dau has it. She said it will be a moral call soon to stop treating her in her reading therapy because she's at a stand still and her attention is getting in the way>> I called my pediatrician and she wants her to see a phycologist before she will treat her! Im a bit sad today!! Im still giving her the omegas with 200 mg vit E>> It's a good idea to see a neuropyschologist to confirm the diagnosis. My son has been helped tremendously by medication. He is successful and happy, which wasn't the case 4 yrs ago before we confirmed he had ADD/Inattentive.
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 22, 2006 17:50:34 GMT -5
The fish oil is not supposed to smell fishy. I suggest you return it to the store.
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Post by 2kids on Mar 23, 2006 9:17:40 GMT -5
Hi mayleng~~ I called the ped neurologist but they said they want her to see a phycologist first? The reg ped Dr secretary said wont even discuss it untill she see's phyc>> Im hoping to find someone to recomend one in my area today!!
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 23, 2006 15:36:22 GMT -5
Hi mayleng~~ I called the ped neurologist but they said they want her to see a phycologist first? The reg ped Dr secretary said wont even discuss it untill she see's phyc>> Im hoping to find someone to recomend one in my area today!! My son saw a Neuro PSYCHOLOGIST for his diagnosis, not a Ped Neurologist. This is the person your doctor wants your dd to see. Make sure you find a good one, the diagnosis is only as good as the doctor doing it.
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nde
Full Member
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Post by nde on Mar 28, 2006 11:21:45 GMT -5
Hi,
Ok, I brought back the nordic naturals ultimate omegas because it was too fishy smelling. Well, I got the new bottle home and guess what--FISHY!! I have other fish oil in gelcaps in the fridge that I've been giving my son but what a dissappointment. Does anyone know if the liquid goes rancid faster than the gelcaps?
Ug, back to the health food store....
Natalie
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 28, 2006 20:12:38 GMT -5
maybe the shipment that the healthfood store got was not good.
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nde
Full Member
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Post by nde on Apr 5, 2006 22:31:25 GMT -5
Hi,
I brought my son to a new integrative med doctor who seems to really know his stuff. He's helping me with ds neurotransmitters and told me that the excess wax in his ears is because he's low in omega 3's!! Has anyone ever heard of this?? That shocked me, but my son does make ALOT of ear wax!! The doc told me to up his fish oil (I have been giving him the 720/480) now hes at 1200epa 600dha. He's says that you can't take too much of these (which I think I heard here)
I'm going to be doing a wheat elimination diet (which I hate to say I"m dreading!) and probably dairy too. I gave him pretzels today for snack and a few minutes after he started eating them, his hands started flapping. (not autistic, ruled out) I thought that was interesting. Not sure if you can get a reaction that quick, but it just seemed so wierd, he wasn't doing it before.
Natalie
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Post by 2kids on Apr 13, 2006 12:17:11 GMT -5
Hi mayleng~~ Just went to the DR. She said the Omegas didnt work because they work only for bipolar? Does this sound right?? My dau didnt like her and wont talk to me about it. She was reluctant to go this morning in the first place. I didnt like the waiting room since there were alot of DR's there were adults with problems as well. I guess that could be scary to a child. The Dr seemed nice but my dau said she's never going back??? I have mixed emotions on it as well. I have a $30 copay and it seems I'll be seeing her alot. Also when I mentioned about the EKG and blood tests she said she doesnt treat that way and it's not nessesary if I wanted that I need to talk to the ped Dr. What do you think on all this? She also did say it's good to be talking and doing research with other moms because thats your best feedback. She was throwing all different med names at me>> Focalin> metadate cd> strattera being the first
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Post by Mayleng on Apr 13, 2006 13:09:19 GMT -5
2kids, Cat can show you clinical studies using Omega 3s for ADHD. Omega3s do help BP. However, personally for my son, Omega 3s have never helped his attention as much as medication does. I still give it to him to supplement his meds.
However, it think it is important that your daughter like the doctor she is seeing. There has be to some "trust" and good relationship. I presume this is a pyschologist. Did she do any evaluation? Did she confirm ADHD and how did she do it? Are you comfortable with the diagnosis? I am not happy with her attitude about EKGs and Bloodtests. My son's Peds, never have any problems when I request for an EKG or bloodtest. My suggestion would be to find another doctor who will work with you and your daughter.
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Post by 2kids on Apr 13, 2006 14:40:08 GMT -5
The Dr spoke with us asked questions ect. Yes she was a phycologists. She is part of a large group but specializes with children. The way she diag is simply by what the cognitive therapist said? She gave me a conners form to give to the teacher and for myself. She did tell me to talk to our ped for EKG so I will. I will try and talk to my dau to find out why she didnt like the DR it could be because she didnt want to be there. Im just wondering wether it would be best just to go back to the other ped who handles the meds herself??
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Post by Mayleng on Apr 13, 2006 15:49:14 GMT -5
She did not do a thorough eval then. She should have checked for other Lds as well instead of just using the connors. I would find a psychologist who will do a full evaluation. However, if you are sure it is the ADHD that is the problem, and have made the decision to try medication, there is no reason why the Peds cannot handle the medication. Psychologists are not able to prescribe the meds anyway, only Pediatrians, neurologists, Psychiatrist can prescribe the meds. I suggest you read up on the medication section. Give Metadate CD a try . It is the one that many have had success with, including my son. That is not to say, that there aren't others have not been successful with it. It depends on the individual child. Finding the right med and dosage with the least side effects will take time, but you might be one of the lucky ones who hit it right the first time.
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Post by joemegmom on Apr 17, 2006 7:52:45 GMT -5
What is your opinion regarding supplements that are DHA free...I have been reading a book by a professor from England who sites research and suggest supplements with only EPA...he recommends evening primrose oil and something called VegEPA ....
Does anyone know where you can get supplements that are soly EPA? The VegEPA company is in England
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Post by catatonic on Apr 17, 2006 9:16:09 GMT -5
What's the book? I'd like to read it.
I'm not crazy about the idea of EPA-only supplementation. The brain has a need for plenty of DHA, and with EPA only, it's possible the required conversion will not take place, and the brain won't get the extra DHA you want to give it. One reason that Omega-3 deficiency is so widespread among ADHD children may be that they have metabolic differences that prevent them from adequately converting short-chain Omega-3 into the long-chain end products. I'd have to read some pretty convincing evidence to be willing to give up the DHA.
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