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Post by Mayleng on Feb 12, 2005 9:44:02 GMT -5
gubbs, I cannot tell you if you should reduce the strattera because, like Cat said it might be a reaction to something in the Omega 3s.
Also, personally I would not go any higher on the Vitamin E. I prefer to be conservative with the Vitamin E and only give 100 iu to 200 iu. a day. There has been some write ups about Vitamin E causing health problems on too high a dose.
I would do as Cat says, and try a different brand of Omega 3s first before changing the dosages of strattera. See if it is a reaction to the Omega 3s. Hyperness changes can be a bad reaction to some of the ingredients. If it was because you need less strattera, it would more than likely be mood changes rather than hyperness.
If you want to try reducing the strattera to 20mgs, it is still within his zone (it's the minimum), you could do that. But I really hate at this point to mess around anymore than that because he is on Prozac as well. And you don't want to play doctor. If you do that for a few days and don't see any improvements, I would raise it backup.
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Post by catatonic on Feb 12, 2005 10:32:53 GMT -5
Gubbs, I notice you're using the Rx-Omega-3. We use that as well, and it's one of the very few my son doesn't react to. It's just fish oil and gelatin capsule. I'd put it very low on the list of possible suspects to cause any behavioral problems. In fact, I'd look for other potential causes before I'd suspect the Rx-Omega-3.
Are you using any other supplements? Made any diet changes? Had a bad week and been eating lots of processed foods? Had a good week and given out lots of treats?
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Post by Mayleng on Feb 12, 2005 10:36:16 GMT -5
Cat, could it be too much Vit. E. I am grasping at straws here.
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Post by gubbs on Feb 12, 2005 11:04:39 GMT -5
You all raise great points. As of this morning I did lower his Strattera to 20mg. I already gave him his Omega and E this morning with Breakfast. I will go to the store today and purchase new vitamin e. Is 100ie sufficient for the day, or should i give him 100ie with each dose of Omega.
I will give this a few days and then check back with all of you.
Thanks so much for all of your responses!!
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Post by Mayleng on Feb 12, 2005 14:18:44 GMT -5
I think you can give 100 iu with each dose if you want. I only ever give 100iu to my son because of his nosebleeds.
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 15, 2005 0:36:07 GMT -5
I have just joined and have been reading most of the post about omega 3 fatty acids. I am very hopeful after reading all of your posts that this can really help my son...and maybe all of us. :-) My concern is how to get the best deal for my money that my son will actually take without a continual fight. We don't have money in our budget to wasate trying alot of different things so I'm trying to get as much info as I can before buying anything. I'm excited, though, and don't want to wait too long. lol My son takes dexedrine 7.5 mg spansules in the am and a 5 mg reg. release in the afternoons. He has few side effects that I know of for sure but has lost weight. He weighs only 54 pounds at 8 yrs 8 months. He is drinking boost daily and eating peanut butter and nuts and whatever else I can get him to eat to try to maintain his weight. That said.....he does NOT swallow pills at all ...period..the end. I think it is more in his head at this point but until he decides he can do it, we are stuck. He also has become very picky about what medicines, foods , etc. that he finds acceptable to ingest. lol things I think taste great, he gags on. Again, mostly in his little head, i think but, nevertheless..... So, i have been looking at the Nordic Naturals Ultimate Omega Liquid lemon 4oz. I know some of you use this. I am curious how long a 4 oz bottle lasts? It looks like 1/2 tsp would do it along with his multi vitamin. ( I would like to get the whole family on it but may be able to find something in a different form for my husband and myself that is less expensive. ) If my son hates the taste, is there a way to disquise it in some other liquid or food? I guess these are my main questions right now. Any ideas would be appreciated. I'm so glad to have found ya'll. y*y
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Post by Mayleng on Feb 15, 2005 7:50:03 GMT -5
kc4braves, My son used to take the Lemon Flavored Nordic Natural Ultimate Omega (stopped because of nosebleeds - I am waiting for his cauterization to heal before I put him back on). The Bottle does last quite a while (about a month or more). He took 1/2 a teaspoon a day, he does not like the taste but will take it for me. I don't know if there is way of hiding the taste. Maybe some other member has ideas of how to do this. Remember to take the Vitamin E. with it. If your son does not want to take it, you and your husband can take it so it won't he a waste of money.
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 15, 2005 9:17:05 GMT -5
I also considered the Coromega for my son. I guess some kids think it taste good and others don't. I'm pretty sure I would hate it, though, with Stevia in it. I'm wondering which I would have better luck getting him to take.....or hiding if he hates it. Kathy
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Post by ohmama on Feb 15, 2005 12:11:37 GMT -5
Hello Kathy and a big Welcome to you! I'm glad you joined us too. Here's a bit of information that you may find useful.... For a FREE SAMPLE of the Coromega to see if it's something your son will take without a fuss you can get this at: www.coromega.comPlease note that the Coromega has 290mg EPA & 190mg DHA The cost is $19.95 for a pack of 28 or $39.95 for a pack of 90. An excellent product for the whole family and at a cost that would be hard to beat for the quality you may want to consider getting RxOmega-3 Factors manuf by Natural Factors. This has 400mg EPA & 200mg DHA and even though it is in a softgel you can easily cut it open and add it to juice. Another plus is that it is pharmaceutical grade and molecularly distilled so you know you are getting a pure product. This is what I use for the kids and I see it is really helping them. This is available for $13.50 or $15. depending on how many you order at a time. There are 120 softgels in a bottle!! You will find it here: www.iherb.comOne other option I would suggest is the Nordic Naturals liquid... Ultimate Omega 3 with 875mg EPA & 625mg DHA (4oz bottle). This will give you 48 servings @ 1/2 tsp per serving for $33.96. They also have Omega 3 Liquid (not the Ultimate Omega) with 450mg EPA & 300mg DHA for $16.96 same 4oz size. You can find that here: www.houseofnutrition.comI hope I didn't make this too confusing.
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 15, 2005 13:05:16 GMT -5
Thanks for the info. I actually have been looking at the Nordic liquid and the Coromega but now I will check out the RxOmega-3 Factors manuf by Natural Factors that you mentioned. If you are taking the omega 3 fatty acids and you are NOT ADHD, do you need to take as much? I keep reading about the therapeutic levels for ADHD but haven't heard what is recomended just as a supplement. Some of the brands have you taking alot more than what I have read even for ADHD and others have you taking very little. Is there an in-between number for non-ADHDers? Also, can the liquids or the gel tabs or the Coromega all be mixed with other stuff? If so, are there any substances they should NOT be mixed with? Also, is there a certain time of day they should be taken? I know my son doesn't need to take his dexedrine spansules with juice, so I was wondering if the omega 3 fatty acids could be mixed with juice and taken at night? I'm just full of questions. lol It is hard for me because I have worked for years in the health care profession. As you know, the medical profession doesn't always look favorably upon people trying to help themselves with supplements, etc. I have also never even been good at remembering to take my own vitamins so....this is all a big change for me. I have finally figured out that the doctor isn't going to be of much help with my son. She is great if you have strep or the flu but not so great with ADHD. So, I'm very happy to find another website that has lots of information and people with experience with practical application. , KAthy
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 15, 2005 13:34:58 GMT -5
Just in case anyone is interested, I went to the site www.houseofnutrition.com that ohmama posted and found the Coromega 28 pack for $11.97 and the 90 count for $23.99. These prices are better than the Coromega website. Just thought I'd mention this in case someone has not already discovered that. Kathy
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Post by ohmama on Feb 16, 2005 14:56:55 GMT -5
Kathy, Thanks for the tip on a lower price with the coromega at houseofnutrition!
We all need the long chain essential omega 3 fatty acids since this is not something the body can make it needs to be added with supplements. It would be hard for anyone to get enough by eating fish, etc. I don't know any normal people so am not sure what dose would be good for such a person. As I understand it, a normal person could get by with using a product that gives you the short chain fatty acids and your body can convert them to the long chain without taking the high EPA & DHA directly. It's just that with a brain disorder that conversion often does not take place. In my opinion the 480mg DHA dose along with an even higher amount of EPA is the minimum goal for everyone. Young kids under 7 years old require a supplement with higher DHA than EPA levels. After this age the EPA can be given priority.
If you are faced with something like bipolar then an even higher dose is required. I give my boys several grams because of this. Some good information on dose can be found by reading "The Omega 3 Connection" by Dr. Andrew Stoll. So, depending on what you are addressing your dose would have to be adjusted.
I think we may have at least one other normal person on the board who is brilliant with resources and information. Cat, I'm talking about you! I am hopeful she will join in this when she is able.
I make it a rule to take any supplements at least an hour or two if possible after or before giving meds. Some supplements do interact with meds and some do not but it is good to be careful just incase. With the omega 3 you can mix it in juice, cereal, or whatever you want to get them to take it as long as it's not a hot liquid. You will want to stay away from heat and light with the oil. I think it has already been brought out that it is good to store this in the refrigerator. If in doubt about mixing it you can call the manufacturer or your pharmacist with questions. There are also several websites that have a drug-nutrient interaction checker to do some research on with your particular med.
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 24, 2005 16:10:28 GMT -5
Ok. So maybe "normal" was the wrong word. lol I meant someone without ADHD. I may not know anyone normal, either. lol
We just got the gel caps and I'm feeling discouraged. I took two and have been burping them up all day. They are now in the frig. lol I have yet to try to give to my kids. Thought I would give after school since he takes his ADHD meds before school. I don't think he's going to agree to even try it, though, because of the smell. What an awful smell. Even in apple juice it wreaks. He will never believe he should drink it. h*lp
Kathy
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 24, 2005 16:44:13 GMT -5
I was wrong! Hurray! I gave the omega 3 to one kid in applejuice and the other in choc. milk. I was about to gag just watching them but....both said...this isn't bad at all. I don't understand it but i'm thankful. I felt like I was on Fear Factor watching people drink bug juice or something. How could they not smell that? Ooh. I still feel yucky. Anyway, this is a positive post. they took it!!! now we will wait and see what develops.
Kathy
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Post by ohmama on Feb 25, 2005 11:16:03 GMT -5
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 25, 2005 12:55:24 GMT -5
I went to iherb.com and bought the RxOmega-3 Factors softgels. I took two and then opened them for the kids. I thought it would be good for the whole family but I'm afraid to take them again. I never heard one burp from the kids or any complaints but...oh my gosh! I felt so bad most of the day after taking them. I could not get rid of the smell. It was everywhere. I am not usually affected much by smells and I have a strong stomach but apparently not for fish oil. lol
Mykids don't care if anything is good for them or not. I made it a game. I didn't lie. I told them ...here's a treat for each of you. It's not medicine but it is good for you. My son asked what it was for and what it had in it. I told him it was good for his brain and his heart and that it had fish in it. lol he looked skeptical but drank it down. Oh...I also kinda added bribary, too. Told them they could have some M and M's if they drank it all and who ever finished first got to pick which color they wanted. LOL I also had it almost frozen like a slush which may have cut the smell. Not sure how they managed to drink it.
Is there any certain time of day that it should be given? I also wonder if I tokk one at a time, if it would still make me sick. Any ideas?
KAthy
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DenverMom
Full Member
Science is only as good as the questions we ask of it.
Posts: 81
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Post by DenverMom on Feb 25, 2005 13:41:48 GMT -5
I've had success with making sure I take BEFORE a meal. Also I think this was already mentioned but refridgerating them seems to help a little too.
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Post by ohmama on Feb 25, 2005 13:50:14 GMT -5
Taking them after food is better for me. Maybe you could mix yours with juice or milk? What about opening the softgel and add a little spoon of jelly to the mix so you wouldn't taste it?
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 25, 2005 14:28:56 GMT -5
Well, it sounds like BEFORE food works for some, AFTER food for others and IN food for yet others?? Guess it's trial and error. lol I didn't mind swallowing the gel caps...no taste or anything. But...then I burped it up for a while and even after that stopped, Ifelt yucky. I think I just couldn't quit smelling it. The smelll was everywhere because i opened the ones for the kids. I scrubbed my hands and the counters and the kids cups and even took out the garbage early to try to get rid of the smell but..... lol I will try once more now that they are refrigerated. Never let it be said i gave up too soon. lol
Kathy
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Post by ohmama on Feb 25, 2005 18:08:18 GMT -5
Kathy, You're a brave soul! Don't forget to take your antioxidants with the oil. This will help too. Keep up the good work .
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Post by G on Feb 25, 2005 22:16:04 GMT -5
If your kids can't swallow the pills, have they tried the lemon flavored liquid by Nordic Naturals, it still has a little bit of a fishy smell but not as bad, smells and tastes a little bit lemony.
So you have any lemon juice in your fridge? use a little bit of that on your hands, it will cut the fish smell. nat
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 26, 2005 10:43:12 GMT -5
Thanks. After day 2, the kids are still taking it fine and I still hate it! lol I will try the lemon juice suggestion for the smell and plan to try one more time. lol
Kathy
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Post by rosie on Feb 27, 2005 4:30:35 GMT -5
Could someone please let me know what doseage of fish oil I should give my 4 year old (21kg). We live in Australia so we probably have different products, but the one I have is 1mg each tablet. I don't want to overdose him. thanks rosie
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Post by catatonic on Feb 27, 2005 4:54:44 GMT -5
I give my 4-year-old (16kg) 1/2 tsp daily of the Nordic Naturals liquid, which contains 875mg total Omega-3 oils including 300mg DHA and 450mg EPA.
I have also given her a single 1g capsule of Natural FActors Rx-Omega-3 containing 200mg DHA and 400mg EPA. She's also taken Now brand DHA-250 which is a very small capsule containing 250mg DHA.
Any of these are fine. My daughter liked the small capsule best because she could easily swallow it. I like the Rx-Omega3 best because it is of the highest quality and completely free of additives that might make things worse. The liquid is very convenient for a child too small to swallow pills.
For children 5 and under, you want to aim for approximately 240mg DHA daily. Ideally you would also include 360mg EPA. However, the addition of EPA does not appear to be as important for the pre-school set as it is for older children, so if you want to opt for a small DHA-only capsule, you're probably fine doing this since your child is only 4.
You don't really need to worry about overdosing the Omega-3 oils. Any excess your brain doesn't need is simply metabolized as any other dietary fat -- like butter -- would be. Fish oil does have a mild anti-coagulant effect (hence its usefulness to cardiovascular health) so be sure to stop taking it prior to any elective surgery just to be safe. One "side effect" we've seen in my daughter from taking fish oil is that she has softer, more regular bowel movements. This has been a good thing!
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Post by rosie on Feb 27, 2005 8:06:37 GMT -5
Thank you so much, Catatonic. Looks like I have been giving him the correct dose these past few days (just started). And good to know that you can't overdose on them. Rosie
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Post by Mayleng on Feb 27, 2005 9:24:47 GMT -5
Welcome to the Board rosie. Which part of Australia are you from? I used to live in Sydney and for a short time in Perth. I was in Sydney for 3 years, many years ago.
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Post by kc4braves on Feb 27, 2005 20:43:31 GMT -5
Just a little update and happy. My kids are still taking the omega- 3s without complaint. In fact, they explained to Daddy that they had to eat their brain food. LOL I just hope we see results in a few weeks. Kathy
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Post by G on Feb 28, 2005 10:29:26 GMT -5
Yeah! It is so much easier when they are willing. My son reminds me to give his fish oil. As long as he has a swig of something to drink afterwards he is fine. Great to hear good news!!
nat
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Post by kc4braves on Mar 2, 2005 11:47:27 GMT -5
So far so good with the omega-3s. Did I read somewhere in all these posts that omega-3s could improve sleep patterns? I know we have only been taking for a short time but ( I think) my son has been sleeping better lately. I hope I don't jinx myself, but wondered if that could have anything to do with it this early on. Last two nights asleep by 9 and didn't get up once to complain about not sleeping or to say he had a nightmare. I guess he could be a fluke but I sure hope not. Kathy
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Post by Mayleng on Mar 13, 2005 10:06:44 GMT -5
Cat, do you give your Non-ADHD kids and yourself, the same dosage of 0mega 3s as challenge boy or do you use a reduced dose?
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