My Daughter's Testing- Help!

[sysiphus]

Hi,


      Thank you in advance for listening to my rant. I've been so upset about my daughter's test results since I got them in the beginning of June that I can't stop obsessing.  I asked, in writing, for my daughter to be tested at school because she seemed inattentive when we attempted to do homework with her. Math was a bit of a struggle, but she was getting all 3's (grade level) in second grade. She was seven at the time of testing, but has since turned eight. I was hoping to get her a 504 because she needs instructions repeated to her sometimes. She said sometimes she doesn't understand a work sheet and the teacher won't reiterate it for her. When I asked to have her tested, the teacher was surprised. She said that while she was a bit fidgety and inattentive, she was capable in all academic areas, but seemed to be really anxious and nervous especially during math. I chalked this up to the fact that I am an anxious person, and so is my older daughter who is GATE identified. I even sort of assumed she was gifted like her sister, but with ADHD potentially.  So, they tested her using Woodcock-Johnson Test of Cognitive Abilities, 4th, Test of Auditory Processing Skills, 3rd, and a few other tests like Conners-3. The testing results that were beyond shocking were the Woodcock Johnson Cognitive. In the report, it was noted that results should be interpreted with caution because she was highly inattentive. Here are the results:

GIA 73
BIA 83
Gf-Gc 89
Comp-Knowledge (Gc) 90
Oral Vocabulary 88
General Information 94
Fluid Reasoning 90
Number Series 96
Concept Formation 83
S-Term Working Memory 84
Verbal Attention 70
Numbers Reversed 100
Cognitive Processing Speed 61
Letter Pattern Matching 55
Pair Cancellation 73

Supplemental Subtests

Auditory Processing 98
Phonological Processing 90
Nonword Repetition 105
Visual Processing 91
Visualization 84
Picture recognition 99

       When I saw 73, I almost passed out. I couldn't even speak to the school psych, who by the way, is a 25 year old substitute school psych, because our regular school psych is out on maternity leave. Then I turned to the Woodcock-Johnson IV Tests of Academic Achievement, which were done by the seasoned education specialist. Here are those results:

Letter-Word Identification 121
Applied Problems 95
Passage Comprehension 90
Calculation 93 Writing sample 90
Word Attack 127
Oral Reading 108
Sentence Reading fluency 110
Math Facts Fluency 112
Sentence Writing Fluency 100
Reading Recall 95
Number Matrices 100
Spelling of Sounds 111

Cluster Scores

Reading 110
Basic Reading Skills 125
Reading Comprehension 90
Mathematics 93
Broad Mathematics 101
Math Calculation Skills 104
Math Problem Solving 96
Written Expression 91
Phoneme-Grapheme Knowledge 121

     So my daughter has the opposite of a learning disability. Her Achievement scores are much better than her cognitive. Her average Achievement scores are over 30 points higher than her GIA. From my research, I've learned that there is a .83 correlation between Cognitive scores and Achievement scores. When I asked the "School Psychologist" how this could be, she couldn't answer. The principle said, "Well, she's just a hard worker." What??? Isn't IQ like a pitcher that only holds what it can according to capacity? The principle to her credit, offered all kinds of services and an IEP based on Other Medical (the ADHD): Math pull-out, special testing accommodations, special seating, blah, blah, blah. I called the District office and asked what I should do if I do not accept the Cognitive Evaluation. They said if I reject it she will no longer get services. So, I rejected services, had the Cognitive Eval. expunged, and the principal who is awesome, gave us a 504, with special seating at the front of the room, directions chunked, longer time for math tests. When I asked the Special Education specialist if she had ever seen Achievement tests so much higher than Cognitive, she said she never had.  I will eventually have her retested by someone outside the school, but for now she has been through enough testing. 

      My question to all of you is, can you make sense of what happened? Was it just the rapport she had with this inexperienced psych?  Was it the fact that she told her she would get candy at the end of testing (so she rushed through)? Was it her anxiety, specifically test anxiety? Was it the ADHD? In my heart, I know the results are incorrect, but I don't know what happened and I'm going to obsess until I understand. Since then, I made an appt. at UCI with a Pediatric Psychiatrist to get treatment for the ADHD and anxiety. That isn't until the middle of August. Any information you can give me will be appreciated beyond words! 

[bros]

Okay, you want to request an IEE - Independent Educational Evaluation. That is how you reject the evaluation. Then the district is given two choices: pay for an evaluation at an outside physician or fight in court that their cognitive evaluation is all you need. Do not go to anyone the district suggests.

She could be 2E - twice exceptional, and have an LD *and* be gifted - but the achievement test results looks like she is average (What does it say in the report?)

[jisp]

I would be curious to see what her WISC IV results looked like. Has she ever had a WISC IV. In my opinion the WISC is much better at pinpointing specific areas of strength and weakness for children as that is specifically what it was designed for. I am not a testing expert. There are others on this site who know a lot more than me about testing. But I would say to you that if YOUR gut says this testing is not accurate than you are probably right. Parents tend to know their children best. And yes testing can be influenced by so many factors. The challenge is that you can not re-test with the same tests and get reliable results.

Another word of caution is to assume that medication for the ADHD and anxiety is going to solve the problem by itself. Even children who have ADHD and anxiety (the two often go together) need solid therapies and supports in addition to medication to make progress. In some cases the medication is less important than the supports. Medication needs to be used cautiously and only in those cases where supports and therapies alone are not enough. I wonder how much her anxiety is due to being in an environment that is not age appropriate. Why won't a teacher explain a worksheet to her that she might not understand? That sounds like a teacher that is NOT INTERESTED IN TEACHING. How many worksheets is this child getting every day? Why, OH WHY, does she even have homework if she is only 8? What sort of play is your daughter engaging in outside of school? Physical activity? Arts? Music? Games? Young children learn through play and using their bodies is very important to their ability to focus. If she is not having enough physical exercise she might not be able to focus.

What makes me sad is that your daughter has probably already internalized that there is something "not right" with how she learns and already feels as though learning is a struggle and frustrating. Maybe she is just a late bloomer. I would focus hard on finding something and some area where she can feel successful and competent and get positive feedback about who she is and how she learns so this does not evolve into a depressive self esteem struggle later on in life.

[healthy11]

sysiphus, welcome to our forum. As I read through your posting, I could "feel" your frustration, and I don't blame you. To me, the key statement is "In the report, it was noted that results should be interpreted with caution because she was highly inattentive."

I have a son who once had a similar statement in his psych report, although his achievement test scores still didn't exceed his IQ scores. The school psych consequently considered him as an average student and tried to refute his need for any support services. In our case, we had already paid, privately, for testing (I was told ADHD is a medical condition, and not something the school could diagnose) so I knew the school's assessment of his IQ was way, way off. Ultimately, after my complaints, the Head Psychologist in our School District agreed to re-test our son instead of relying on the individual school psych's results. (FYI, they had to administer a different test battery, because most tests can't be repeated within a year, else the results are considered invalid.) In any case, when the Head Psych's results were in, my son's IQ scores increased tremendously, and they conceded that he was Highly Gifted, with ADHD and LDs in reading and writing.

It was once explained to me that an IQ test is a "snapshot" of a person's potential on a particular day, not a "concrete number." With young children, the results are considered even more variable. A person who might have a slight cold, or allergies, and didn't sleep well, or didn't have a good breakfast, or was nervous, etc. could score differently than if they were feeling 100%. The fact that your daughter DOES have ADHD no doubt also plays a role in her results. I'm not sure what approaches you're planning to use to manage it, but if medication is involved, it would probably be better to schedule any future testing for when your daughter is able to benefit from its effects.

Bottom line: my feeling is that your "gut" is probably right, and your daughter could very well be gifted, along with having ADHD and math anxiety, too. As Bros indicated, the term for someone like that is "2E," and I've compiled a bunch of resources about "2E" here: millermom.proboards.com/thread/9972/twice-exceptional-gifted-adhd-resources

[sysiphus]

Jul 23, 2018 11:22:16 GMT -5 bros said:

Okay, you want to request an IEE - Independent Educational Evaluation. That is how you reject the evaluation. Then the district is given two choices: pay for an evaluation at an outside physician or fight in court that their cognitive evaluation is all you need. Do not go to anyone the district suggests.

She could be 2E - twice exceptional, and have an LD *and* be gifted - but the achievement test results looks like she is average (What does it say in the report?)

    
           Thank you, Bros! I thought she was 2E at the outset of testing...Now, in light of the testing, I doubt that is the case. I don't even care about her being above average, I just am having a very hard time with the GIA of 73. The district has granted my petition to expunge after I sent them a two page letter with citations. I was furious that they turned down my initial request. My main concern was that her future teachers would look in her cum, see the report, and treat her like a borderline child, when I know she isn't and her achievement scores prove she isn't. Also, there is something going on with her that the testing didn't show. Her visual memory was low. She also had fine motor issues, executive function issues. The run of the mill ADHD stuff. I will have her assessed privately at some point, and I will not go through the district ever again. Thank you!

[sysiphus]

Jul 23, 2018 12:15:38 GMT -5 jisp said:

I would be curious to see what her WISC IV results looked like. Has she ever had a WISC IV. In my opinion the WISC is much better at pinpointing specific areas of strength and weakness for children as that is specifically what it was designed for. I am not a testing expert. There are others on this site who know a lot more than me about testing. But I would say to you that if YOUR gut says this testing is not accurate than you are probably right. Parents tend to know their children best. And yes testing can be influenced by so many factors. The challenge is that you can not re-test with the same tests and get reliable results.

Another word of caution is to assume that medication for the ADHD and anxiety is going to solve the problem by itself. Even children who have ADHD and anxiety (the two often go together) need solid therapies and supports in addition to medication to make progress. In some cases the medication is less important than the supports. Medication needs to be used cautiously and only in those cases where supports and therapies alone are not enough. I wonder how much her anxiety is due to being in an environment that is not age appropriate. Why won't a teacher explain a worksheet to her that she might not understand? That sounds like a teacher that is NOT INTERESTED IN TEACHING. How many worksheets is this child getting every day? Why, OH WHY, does she even have homework if she is only 8? What sort of play is your daughter engaging in outside of school? Physical activity? Arts? Music? Games? Young children learn through play and using their bodies is very important to their ability to focus. If she is not having enough physical exercise she might not be able to focus.

What makes me sad is that your daughter has probably already internalized that there is something "not right" with how she learns and already feels as though learning is a struggle and frustrating. Maybe she is just a late bloomer. I would focus hard on finding something and some area where she can feel successful and competent and get positive feedback about who she is and how she learns so this does not evolve into a depressive self esteem struggle later on in life.

Hi Jisp...I wondered about WISC IV. In all my online research, so many people spoke about the WISC being used in diagnosing an LD. I will ask to have WISC used the next time she is tested. She has a weakness, I just don't know if it's the ADHD or some other LD that the testing didn't pick up. It was virtually impossible for me to find any research on the Reverse LD pattern, where achievement was higher than IQ. It seems relatively rare. If you know of any research that talks about this, I would love to read it. I did find one article:    www.helloq.com/content/dam/ped/ani/us/helloq/media/TOSP-Winter-2014-Final-sweeney.pdf
The article basically says that sometimes kids with anxiety bomb IQ tests, but feel more confident in the Achievement portion because they were more familiar, and hence, more confident with the material. Other than that, I found nothing.    As for her teacher, she told them that they were big kids now (in 2nd grade), and they needed to work without support. The other kids seemed fine to my daughter, though when I talked to the other parents, their kids were not fine either. Bottom line, my daughter felt embarrassed, and would ask the boy sitting next to her for help with the instructions. It makes sense...Receptive language seems to be a weakness. I agree regarding the worksheets. They do SO many! On Thursday when their folders come home, they're stuffed with worksheets. 

     I wholeheartedly agree with you regarding the use of medication. I'm just starting this journey, but so far, it's so hard to find a pediatric psych that takes insurance. All of the ones I called only take cash. That could really add up. The good part is, the pediatric psychiatrist at UCI may take us on as a new patient for counseling as well! I guess he does both. She definitely needs it. She is really anxious and chews her nails to the cuticle. I do think she is a late bloomer. She is very impulsive, funny, and outgoing. Not quiet and studious like my older daughter. I worry about her self-esteem as well... 
        

[sysiphus]

Jul 23, 2018 12:36:07 GMT -5 healthy11 said:

sysiphus, welcome to our forum. As I read through your posting, I could "feel" your frustration, and I don't blame you. To me, the key statement is "In the report, it was noted that results should be interpreted with caution because she was highly inattentive."

I have a son who once had a similar statement in his psych report, although his achievement test scores still didn't exceed his IQ scores. The school psych consequently considered him as an average student and tried to refute his need for any support services. In our case, we had already paid, privately, for testing (I was told ADHD is a medical condition, and not something the school could diagnose) so I knew the school's assessment of his IQ was way, way off. Ultimately, after my complaints, the Head Psychologist in our School District agreed to re-test our son instead of relying on the individual school psych's results. (FYI, they had to administer a different test battery, because most tests can't be repeated within a year, else the results are considered invalid.) In any case, when the Head Psych's results were in, my son's IQ scores increased tremendously, and they conceded that he was Highly Gifted, with ADHD and LDs in reading and writing.

It was once explained to me that an IQ test is a "snapshot" of a person's potential on a particular day, not a "concrete number." With young children, the results are considered even more variable. A person who might have a slight cold, or allergies, and didn't sleep well, or didn't have a good breakfast, or was nervous, etc. could score differently than if they were feeling 100%. The fact that your daughter DOES have ADHD no doubt also plays a role in her results. I'm not sure what approaches you're planning to use to manage it, but if medication is involved, it would probably be better to schedule any future testing for when your daughter is able to benefit from its effects.

Bottom line: my feeling is that your "gut" is probably right, and your daughter could very well be gifted, along with having ADHD and math anxiety, too. As Bros indicated, the term for someone like that is "2E," and I've compiled a bunch of resources about "2E" here: millermom.proboards.com/thread/9972/twice-exceptional-gifted-adhd-resources

Wow, Healthy11...Your son's story is a great one! Was his IQ low like my daughter's? I'm afraid to let anyone in the district retest my daughter. Another mom who believed her daughter has a LD had this same sub-school psych test her daughter and found her IQ to be extremely low as well. This mother is also a school psych in another district, so she went to the district and demanded they retest her using the District Psychiatrist. He found her to have an average IQ with a learning disability. I am just afraid to put my daughter through testing again. I don't want her to think something is wrong with her. I want to wait a while, and see how she does in school this year with a 504 in place. I think those accommodations will help her a lot. If that IQ assessment is correct, she will begin to struggle this year, right? I will definitely look at the 2E resources. Thank you! 

[jisp]

Jul 23, 2018 20:45:41 GMT -5 sysiphus said:

Jul 23, 2018 12:15:38 GMT -5 jisp said:

 As for her teacher, she told them that they were big kids now (in 2nd grade), and they needed to work without support. The other kids seemed fine to my daughter, though when I talked to the other parents, their kids were not fine either. Bottom line, my daughter felt embarrassed, and would ask the boy sitting next to her for help with the instructions. It makes sense...Receptive language seems to be a weakness. I agree regarding the worksheets. They do SO many! On Thursday when their folders come home, they're stuffed with worksheets. 

   

OK...I WISH YOU COULD SEE MY ANGER!!!!  This teacher is being ABUSIVE.  Since when is being 7 considered a "BIG KID".  Walk around a college campus and look at kids in their late teens and then look at a seven year old!!!  Is there any resemblance?  You need to talk to the principal, the superintendent and the school board and complain.  I shudder to think about the damage this one teacher is doing.  And this type of abusive teaching can have a LASTING impact on young children affecting their attitude about learning and school for years to come.   This teacher might not be physically hitting the kids in her class but when she denies them the right to be inquisitive and ask questions and to ask for help she is teaching them how to be placid and NOT LEARN.    Your daughter would be better off sitting at home watching PBS and not going to school than being exposed to this type of abusive teaching.  This is a LAZY second grade teacher who has little understanding of pedagogy, child development and what we know about learning and the brain.  

I have grown kids.  My middle son was a complex kid whose LD includes slow processing and short term memory issues and language processing challenges.  His second grade teacher (who was indeed an excellent teacher) noticed our son often would get a worksheet and then not understand what to do and raise his hand and ask her to come over to help him.  Because of this, the teacher suggested we test our son.  That testing was mis-read by the public school and only properly analyzed when it was taken to private neuropsychologists who had a better understanding of the type of complex kid our son was.  Our son had a long and difficult road to adulthood filled with many failures and struggles.  Even with us working constantly to make sure he was in environments that supported him it was a challenge and his self-esteem took a good beating.   Those scars from his early childhood live today.  So despite the fact that our son just got his PhD and has a prestigious post-doc if you talk with him he always feels as though he is not quite good enough.  Every time a teacher gave up on him or insisted he was asking for help because he was lazy or not trying it was an arrow into his motivation and self-esteem.  And although we worked like crazy to protect him he had enough of those arrows that when he was a teen he was seriously at risk of giving up altogether.  

SO SOS!!!  Get this small child into some environment where she is getting positive feedback about herself and her abilities.  Whether it be an art class, a music lesson, dance, horse back riding, girl-scouts...something anything to counter act what this ABUSIVE teacher is doing.

[bros]

Them not using the WISC makes it that much easier for the neuropsych to do testing!

You need to request the IEE within 12 months of the initial testing. I would recommend doing that now, since either way, she won't get the testing for at least a month or two - neuropsychs have backlogs.

That teacher is an idiot. 2nd grade is just more of first grade. Third & Fourth grade is when the concepts start to get a bit abstract, why discourage the kids from asking for help at such a young age?

By the way, when I was 4 or 5, my Full Scale IQ was in the 70s.

Now it's 115.

[jisp]

Actually it is STUPID at ANY age to discourage students to not ask for help!!!! Telling students they can not ask questions is the opposite of the socratic method and really should be a reason to fire this teacher.

[bros]

Jul 25, 2018 7:30:52 GMT -5 jisp said:

Actually it is STUPID at ANY age to discourage students to not ask for help!!!! Telling students they can not ask questions is the opposite of the socratic method and really should be a reason to fire this teacher.

Definitely! But sometimes in higher grades, teacher's like to go "NO QUESTIOSN!!!" - you think an elementary teacher would be a bit more supportive

[healthy11]

I echo Jisp and Bros' anger about a 2nd grade teacher who discourages students from asking questions. To answer your question, my son's IQ was not found to be as low as your daughter's, but the school still underestimated it by about 35 points...

Since you mention that your daughter struggles with receptive language issues, I wonder if Central Auditory Processing deficits (CAPD) could be affecting her. You can learn more at sites like www.speechpathology.com/articles/central-auditory-processing-in-clinical-1523-1523 or search for past discussions about CAPD within our forum... The evaluation should be covered by insurance and done by an audiologist, not by schools who do "screenings."

The other thing that jumped out at me, on your daughter's Woodcock Johnson cognitive testing, was her cognitive processing speed. I wonder if Sluggish Cognitive Tempo (SCT) is a factor? www.russellbarkley.org/factsheets/SluggishCognitiveTempo.pdf

[sysiphus]

Healthy11, because she struggled with understanding directions, I asked them to test her for Auditory Processing Disorder. Is that the same as CAPD? Her results on the TAPS-3 were: 86 Low Average. Now that I'm looking at these scores to respond to you, I noticed that she had REALLY low Visual Memory (55) and General Memory (66). This was on the WRAML-2. Her lowest score was a 1 on picture memory. I have to give it to them, they gave her a lot of tests. At some point, she must have checked out. All of these test were conducted within a week because they wanted to finish by the end of the school year. I got the results on my birthday, May 29th. One of the worst days of my life.

As for the teacher, now that all of you are making me think of it, it's making me mad too! She gets away with some of this stuff because she presents as a tough love type. My older daughter had her as well, and she was good to both my girls, but both feared her. She has a couple of boys on the spectrum, and one of them has sever ADHD. I think generally she's tired and annoyed. As for her teaching style, lots of the parents hate her. I never did because I felt like my little one needed a lot of structure. I didn't like her turning her down for help, but you know, in public school you hear a lot of "they can't spend a lot of time with any one child because there are 30 in the class." Now that I think about it, it's absurd. How long can it take to read over the instructions with a few of the kids that need it? I have to say, once I spoke with her about half way though the year and told her my daughter was struggling in math, she took a lot more time to help her with the content. I would never teach that way, and most of the teachers are not like her. Our public school is a 9, if you buy into that sort of thing. Most of the teachers are great. I'm glad in the Fall we will get someone else. So what causes horrible picture memory? Design memory was a 9, picture memory was a 1!!! If you knew my daughter, you would know that it's because she tunes out a lot, you have to repeat things and ask her if she's listening. I feel like the ADHD was really present in this testing. When I told my husband that lots of ADHD kids do really well on cognitive tests, and can hold it together through testing, he said "well, our kid couldn't."

I just looked at the Sluggish Cognitive Tempo info and it sounds like her somewhat. She's not prone to dozing off when bored though. She is a bundle of energy, and is only happy when there is a plan to go somewhere or do something. She is prone to boredom!

[healthy11]

I'm not an audiologist, so I'm not sure if they are exactly the same, but most people on this forum do use the terms CAPD/APD interchangeably. My son didn't have a school screening for APD, but was tested by an audiologist, and I recall it included use of a special "soundproof" room. Here's a link to a .pdf explaining more:
www.asha.org/Events/convention/handouts/2011/Heymann-Kooper/

As far as the WRAML, here are some links: www.ldonline.org/xarbb/topic/5782
scholar.uwindsor.ca/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1493&context=etd

[jisp]

Sysiphus,
I don't remember my son's scores (he is now 27) but his verbal memory scores were in the single digits and he is a very slow processor as well. Because we had the WISC IV done in addition to the other tests there was never any doubt about our son's intelligence. But for years it looked as though our son was "tuning out" or just not trying. You would explain something to him and 5 minutes later he would need it explained to him again. Nothing seemed to go in. Even special educators became frustrated with our son. And he also developed a mood disorder and was explosive on top of all.

It took an amazing resident in cognitive psychology to "unlock" our son's brain. He explained to us and to our son that our son's brain was like a large bottle with a very narrow neck. When information came at him too fast and too much it simply flowed over the edges and never made it to the inside. This psychologist taught our son how to slow down the trickle of information got into his long term memory and there it would stick. It was amazing. And our son went from failing all subjects across the board to getting A's in college courses.

So the moral of the story is:
1: Persist and find a neuropsychologist that is skilled and very knowledgeable about complex kids
2: Seek out clinicians that know and have experience working with children like your child. Do not expect that just because somebody has a degree they have the knowledge or experience to help your child learn how to learn
3: Focus on learning skills versus content. Content is easy. A motivated young adult can learn all the content taught from k-12 in a short period of time. But the super-powers about how to learn and hold onto new information is a skill that will last a lifetime and is easier taught when a child is young. Once they have this skill it will open doors.
4: Be creative about financing getting your child help. Learn to be a strong advocate for your child with the public school system. Look for grants and outside resources. I know one mom who discovered her local Lions Club had money and used that. Try to not let cost get in the way and remember it is less expensive to spend money on therapies for a young child than it is to remediate and provide therapies for a messed up young adult.
5: I REPEAT: Nurture your daughter's inner strengths. Our son never stopped loving learning despite all his challenges and that is because we never stopped learning at home. If he had an interest we would help him find a way to pursue it. Music was a great outlet. So was drawing and art. For other children it is something different. It might be nature and outdoors. It might be community service and working with younger kids. It might be animals. But by focusing on what your daughter "CAN" do in addition to trying to seek help for what she can't do, you are teaching her about her strengths as well as her weaknesses.

[bros]

Honestly, something seems off with the scores on that first test. I think you need to see a neuropsychologist to get a clearer picture.

Like, I had some... unusual scores when I was young, with some of my skilled areas barely poking through.

But if you see a neuropsych, make sure the district pays for it through an IEE, then they have to consider it like they consider their own evaluations. If you get it privately, they only have to "consider" it, which could be "hey we looked at the pieces of paper, then we put it in the permanent educational record"

[healthy11]

While it's not exactly the same situation as you find your daughter in, you might find the following discussion thread to be worth reading: millermom.proboards.com/thread/12458/confused-help-test-results

[invisibleink]

I know this is a bit old, but I'm hoping that it can still be helpful to get feedback.

You asked about picture memory and design memory. These are both major limitations for my son, too. He has ADHD (and a few other things), but these problems went beyond what was expected of ADHD. He also has developmental / brain based vision issues, too.

It was helpful to have my son evaluated by a developmental optometrist. The vision diagnoses allowed my son to have much-needed accommodations that weren't possible under ADHD alone (larger font, single sided worksheets, enlarged copies of diagrams, etc). The symptoms of these vision problems can look a lot like ADHD, and they often co-exist.

If you haven't had an Occupational Therapy evaluation it may also be helpful since you mentioned some motor issues.

At this point, if the school tests for something themselves, I will follow that up with private, outside testing. And then I prepare myself for what I will do when I realize that the school really will not do much of anything with the outside testing results, and will only use their information to make decisions.

My son started out struggling with handwriting in 2nd grade, but it wasn't until 4th grade that he took the nosedive. That seems to be a big transition year for a lot of kids, from what I've read.

Stay on top of it, and TRUST YOUR GUT above all else. It will nearly always be on the the right path. Getting your daughter into positive activities is a great suggestion--we did Tae Kwon Do. Self control, positive feedback, and helps with motor planning issues.

[invisibleink]

Jul 26, 2018 11:23:58 GMT -5 bros said:

Honestly, something seems off with the scores on that first test. I think you need to see a neuropsychologist to get a clearer picture.

Like, I had some... unusual scores when I was young, with some of my skilled areas barely poking through.

But if you see a neuropsych, make sure the district pays for it through an IEE, then they have to consider it like they consider their own evaluations. If you get it privately, they only have to "consider" it, which could be "hey we looked at the pieces of paper, then we put it in the permanent educational record"

I did an IEE for Occupational Therapy for my son.  In my experience, the district did not consider it any more strongly than any other information that originated from outside the district.  It seemed that if it was not done by their staff, it was subject to the "look and file".

Federal law states that IEE's must be at a reasonable expense.  Some states (mine included) strictly limit the cost they will pay for an IEE--in our state it was called the "State Rate".  It has to be at least half of what a private practitioner would normally charge.  This is accepted mostly by the large children's / teaching hospitals, and around here they had 8-12 month wait lists when I called.  I ended up being a bit creative:  the district approved an amount up to the state rate, and I personally paid the balance to the provider.  Nobody voiced objections about this, and I only waited 1 month.  

Check your state laws carefully about IEE cost limitations so you know ahead of time what the deal is.