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Post by therose on Jan 26, 2010 19:04:35 GMT -5
Do not ever doubt your position. But there will be times, that you may think you are at fault. That is the moment, when you change your track of thinking, and go do another activity like rewarding yourself with a food that you have been craving for. Anything, that will amuse you and take your mind off things. I am glad, you are building up support that will back you up. Just note, the professionals - the outsiders - are viewed as such from my own experience. Perhaps you can get further help of support at the top level of the health region. Perhaps there are aware of the situation that parents are having with their special needs children in the school system, and may want to offer a bigger stick to whack a few heads in the education system. Just a thought?
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Post by kjgdid on Jan 26, 2010 23:58:55 GMT -5
Everyone one here knows how crappy the education system is. No one will do anything about it though. I do think that the ministry wants this to go away. At least I hope so. But we will see. I received a call from the regional dir for SK learning today to ask if dd had received course work sent home by SD as promised. I said nope. He said contact him immediately if it does not happen tomorrow. Karen
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Post by therose on Jan 27, 2010 22:37:45 GMT -5
Just try, even though you may think it is useless. I done and wasted my time on a lot of things, but I kept in mind that if I did not do these things, I would regret it someday. I learned something, people may not want to help, but they do care. They may not be in the position to help you, due to the politics or even losing their job, but they do TALK among each other, their friends, and family. You never know who they know in the system, that can help you. One night while the Liberals were in power, I received a phone call from a bureaucrat , not a politician, after 9:00 at night. He apologized for phoning at this time of night, he wanted to help me on a number of issues. To make this short, over the years I have found that certain people in certain positions in government can help you, without you knowing about it. Keep this in mind. Have faith in yourself, and even when you fail, try again using a different tactic, but never change your story and the beliefs that you hold dear. I know I have a few people in government rooting for me, and they are willing to help, when they can. By the way, I think the regional dir for learning, probably received a phone call, and probably not a nice one. This could be a signal that people are taking sides. So, do contact him, if homework has not been received or has been received. It is an opportunity to talk and discuss the issues. If homework has been deliver, talk about what concerns you about the homework. As long as you are talking about education and your daughter, it is an opportunity to state your side of things.
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Post by kjgdid on Jan 28, 2010 11:25:16 GMT -5
Hi Nancy I also think he received a phone call that he did not enjoy. I have noticed in the last 2 conversations I have had with him he is a lot more interested in pushing these people and is no longer stating his hands are tied.
When I spoke to him last he said in speaking to the super of the SD that dd had a lot of assignments that were missing such as science assignments and computer assignments and several assignments that were incomplete.
DD received an envelope yesterday as promised.
The envelope included 2 progress reports. A science progress report that lists several quizzes that are missing. I had requested from the dir of ed on Jan 10th that dd be allowed to go in before or after school to complete these quizzes because they will not let dd complete them at home. The dir of ed denied my request. No outstanding assignments are listed.
In computer class there is 5 outstanding assignments. As I stated to the dir of ed on Jan 10th dd does not have access to the schools computers at home and requested that a convenient time be arranged before or after school to complete these assignments which was denied.
The envelope included a science assignment that had 1 short answer question that dd had missed. Not several incomplete assignments as stated.
It also included 2 new math assignments.
That was the complete contents of the envelope.
I have emailed him to say the package arrived and listed the contents of the envelope. I cced this email to all my ministerial cc buddies. This SD has no shame and will obvious lie to anyone.
One thing that makes it particularly more difficult for parents in this province is all the people in administrative roles all seem to know each other and seem to have personnel relationships for example the super that works for the SD that the regional dir has been in contact with the regional dir for SK learning was the best man at her wedding.
The dir of ed for the SD and the the regional dir belong to the same church and the both sit on several of the same boards and are all members of several of the same associations and she personally knows his children.
The superintendent that we re dealing with last year[ a different one from this year] used to work for years for the ministry and the regional dir was his supervisor.
It is very incestious here among educational professionals because of all of these personal relationships.
Which in my view makes it harder for parents because of these relationships.
This regional dir for SK learning also has a son with Aspergers and has his own struggles with the educational system in getting his son's needs met.
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Post by therose on Jan 28, 2010 13:05:09 GMT -5
Yes, in provinces that have smaller populations you will find this. It can also be used to your advantage. As you indicated, the regional dir for SK learning, has his own struggles, and this could be key for you to advance your cause. The autism group, is a lot more vocal, and better organized to push for change at the administration level, shaking at the tree who can change things and have the power to do so. However, he has probably seen the same things at work with his son and other children like him, at the school level. No doubt, his son is receiving more services and help, than the kid who lives in another neighbourhood, who pay less taxes. There is more of us in that category, than his. He is an insider, who knows the system and can work it to his benefit. He is also using his position to do so. It is unlikely, that others who are in the position of approval for services, are denying his son for service. However, he is quite aware, when going to meetings of the local autism, that this is the case. of denial of services, based on who you are, rather than the need. I call it good old "Catholic guilt" working on this man, so he can look at himself each morning. So work on this, but whatever you do, do not tell him you are aware of these factors, except in general ways - such as why is my child denied, when little Suzie, the mayor's child is receiving services, and has the same diagnosed as my child. One thing we all have in common, no matter what the special-need is, all of us parents can agree with, there is systematic biases within the education system, that provides unequal and unfair treatment toward special-needs children and their parents.
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Post by kjgdid on Jan 29, 2010 10:19:10 GMT -5
Hi Nancy I do work on this when dealing with him. I often say kids like ours, children with diagnosis like ours etc. Funny thing about Catholic guilt the man actually is Catholic. I know that he has had his own struggles with the ED system in this province because he has shared some of them with me.He seems to me to be a decent person but because there is such a lack of accountability for Ed in this province the people who are genuine can not do anything. I also cc any correspondence to the assist deputy Min for SK ED he also has a dd with ASD who attended public school in SK. I honesty believe that the Min of ED wants this situation to go away as fast as possible but the SD is unwilling to work with them. So I help make everyone in the Min of Ed as uncomfortable as possible for example my dd received a updated outstanding assignment list yesterday from the SD. All assignments on the list with the exception of three were sent back in some even marked and returned to her. I took the list and scanned it in with the documentation of the assignments that were complete and handed in from the list and sent the regional dir a email with the documentation and cced it to all my ministerial cc buddies. I view this as my contribution to these people as an honest look at how kids with unique learning needs are treated by SD's in the province and a brief view of my life as a parent trying to get my child educated in this province. It doesn't hurt my cause that I appear to be extremely reasonable and the SD appears to be incompetent bullies.
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Post by therose on Jan 29, 2010 13:11:08 GMT -5
Make them look bad.
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Post by kjgdid on Jan 30, 2010 23:54:31 GMT -5
Hi Nancy My husband and I went into Saskatoon to meet with the mediator before we met with him we met with the executive dir of SK Association of Communityf living and the advocate from the same organization. The executive dir talked to us about how to structure the meeting. The mediator explained the process and how it is voluntary and how everyone has to agree on who will participate. We talked about how if mediation did not work the possibility of it going to arbitration. We were asked what we wanted which is a homebound program. The mediator explained that this situation was what he called a omgmega situation for the ministry of education which he explained was an acronom for oh my god make it go away. When we left the meeting Kevin the excutive dir said that he had been to a lot of mediation meetings and it appeared to him that the mediator was on our side. my husband and I both think that the SD will refuse to participate in mediation which will look bad for them and make us appear to be reasonable. Nothing can happen for the next two weeks because the dir of ed is away so I will keep pushing the regional dir of children's services to get the SD to allow my daughter to take mid terms. Karen
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Post by therose on Feb 2, 2010 17:05:49 GMT -5
I guess I am in the same type of situation, the oh my god, make it go away. What I want, and it won't be for grade 9, will be in grade 10. Where two hours are set aside, for her to take her reading lessons, specialized right down to her sounds, and other lessons that cannot be done at home, or by the school teacher. The rest of the day, she will take 3 subjects, which will be math, and two sciences of her choosing. For English, although not attending the regular English class, is to reduce the amount of knowledge, and work that will fit in neatly to what she is doing in the specialized lessons. At home I will supplied the needed lessons on grammar, spelling, and other mechanical skills, to complement the specialized language lessons. For other subjects, that are require in grade 10, since they are bird courses, she will attend for tests, hand in assignments, and where I make sure she does all the require work. The only thing she does not do, is attend class. The teachers will do they part, to grade her work and critique her writing in a constructive way, that leads to improvements, and where she will be motivated to start to make the connections and understand what is good writing, and to self-correct when writing. Tall order, but it has been agree upon with the teachers. It is the upper levels of the system, that is stalling big time. To allow this, would be to open up the doors, for the gifted as well as other students whose needs were not met at the elementary stage. These are the kids who are too smart for remedial class, and not dumb enough to qualify for reading and writing services. I estimate 30 % of any classroom, have students like this, who would benefit having programs like the one I describe. The board officials want to prove me wrong. They believe she has the essential skills to past the written portion of the CRT. I don't, and now the teachers are on my side. They are in the process of collecting hard data, such as written demand tests over the years and tests written this year to prove and support the fact she is in dire need of specialized help and will not pass the CRT, just like the other pass CRTs. I have not seen any of her written tests personally, and in english, likely she has failed each and everyone. However she is given orals, days later and this helps her to keep her grades in the 80s, and to ensure that she did studied for the test. The teachers are discovering her weaknesses and strengths, and how they impact each other. The only conclusion, she bright, creative but she sure could use targeted help to improve reading and writing. If she did get the proper help, her average would jump into the 90s with no problem. If the school board allows it, than they will be opening the door for 10 other students inside that school alone, all with specialized alternative programing, that is unique to their situation. The education system cause the problem in the first place, they are the ones to correct it. They have not done so, because they are too accustom in using different tactics to make parents go away. One day in the future, when our kids are out of school, there will a class action suit right across Canada, suing the public education system for not providing the proper education. Parents like us, will have tons of paper to prove the school did not provide. It is just a matter of time when it happens, and not if. I was told, the moves made by the school and the school board since grade 1, are grounds for a nice civil suit, where the school will loose. The school board officials, will be deciding on the legal aspects, rather than what is the right thing to do. I just have to bide my time, while the teachers make the case for my daughter.I think in your case, the people who have given you helpful information and knowledge, will be working behind the scenes to make the mediation meeting a reality. So keep on pushing where ever you can. Just do not change your pattern.
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 3, 2010 11:06:40 GMT -5
Hi Rose I agree at some point in the future well after both my kids are done with school someone will step up and say enough.I will welcome that. All of this has to do with fiscal responsibility. The SD views our kids as being liabilities that they have to fit into well defined boxes.It is up to the child to fit into the box rather the ed system to create a learning environment that meets their unique learning style. When they are called out they blame the child and then the parent's. Our children are seen as being bright so are not seen as being as needy. I have said if my dd expressed her frustration and anxiety outwards in this environment such as by breaking property or hurting people it would become more important to them to understand the impact. In the school my children attended there are 346 kids from k to 12. Of these 346 kids 90 were on plans last year. Disabilities run on average at approx 1 in 12. There should be approx 37 kids on plans there. It would seem then that the 50 kids are on behavioural support plans. All PPP's[IEP's], Student support plans[504] and behaviour support plan's are the responsibility of the resource department which consist of 2 resource teachers with at least 45 kids on heir individual caseloads. It is no wonder that nothing ever gets done. Karen
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Post by therose on Feb 5, 2010 0:16:39 GMT -5
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 5, 2010 10:42:00 GMT -5
The main problem with this type of action in Canada is the provinces are responsible for education. With the exception of the Human rights code and the Charter of Rights and Freedoms everything is done provincially.
Even with the Human Rights tribunal it takes years, is very expensive and once it reaches the human rights office and they decide to investigate everyone is under a gag order.
I know of a family here in SK who has a child with severe autism who will become aggressive. The school the child attended thought it was appropriate to lock the child n a closet. The parents disagreed and took it to human rights it took 7 years and they lost.
Most parents do not know what should be happening, what their child's rights are or how to insist that they get what they need.
In my specific situation I had a interesting conversation with someone from the health region. She has been involved with my kids for 3 years. She phoned Crandall the regional dir of children's services for SK learning on my behalf last week to discuss with him that what we have been saying about our kids and the school is actually happening.
He apparently told her he knows what we are saying is accurate and recognizes that there is no accountability between the SD's and provincial government so his hands are tied in terms of forcing the SD to do anything.
He also asked her to get me to stop emailing all my ministry cc buddies and requested that she ask me just to phone him instead. After I stopped laughing I said no not happening this guy has been involved in this situation for over a year and has done nothing other than listen to my concerns then suggest we wait and then go along with the SD.
Besides I am having fun scanning in all the letters from the SD and school board and responding to them on line. This has become a form of entertainment for me and I think it is important for the people who make decisions about legislation in this province to have a view of what their legislation results in. I am a tax payer and will continue to bring forth my concerns. Karen
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Post by therose on Feb 6, 2010 11:45:16 GMT -5
It is the way the court system is set up, specifically civil actions. One needs a large pocketbook to go against government when dealing with actions that are fundamentally constitutional challenges. We are seeing it with the First Nations and Inuit, taking the government to court on actions of the government that impacts their way of life and quality of life. In this case, they have lawyers who have taken their cause to heart, and have work on their behalf, and in some cases free of charge. Education issues have not reach the point where lawyers are willing to work on the behalf of parents and children, but it is coming. Disabilities and disorders of children, occurs right across the spectrum of the social/economic line. It is just a matter of time, when professionals and others in the high income and social standing, will be impacted by what parents and children are dealing with in the lower social/economic stratum. At the moment, the public education systems are very careful not to step on the toes of the ones who are in the upper levels of the social/economic sphere. One of the things parents can do to make it difficult for the education system, is to refuse to answer any questions, relating to social/economic items. Questions such as job, years of schooling, income, volunteer activities, political/educational thoughts are question that should be refuse by all. The data is not necessary for them to do their job. The data that is necessary is the health items, and other events (death of a parent) that directly impact learning and affect education policy in all levels. The questions that are asked, the data that is collected, are data that produces policies that discriminates against the users of the systems, and as a result our graduates have both various levels of skills and abilities in the fundamentals necessary to do advance work, and various levels in knowledge. An uneven education, where an even education would be, the graduates have more or less equal ability in the fundamentals necessary to do advance work, and have various levels of knowledge, which is dependent on a host of factors, and one of them being the goals of the individual. We have a system now, many are force into goals, because of their poor skills in reading and writing or ones that are force into goals based on their disability/disorder, according to their social/economic standing in the community. I too have fun, when I know I am making headway and can no longer ignore me by being silent. One word of advice, others surrounding you, your family and friends, those outside that circle - some may object to what you are doing. I have long ago give up on those who object to what I was doing. It will be a waste of time to do so, but we are humans, and you will try to educate them, and convince them they are wrong. Do so but keep this in mind; do not get side-tracked, and continue on and focus on your own goals. I had to learn the hard way, when I started to listen to those around me. It prevented me from moving forward my goals at a steady pace. So have fun, celebrate the little victories because we cannot do much over the legal ramifications, but we should be aware of them and how it impacts the education of our children. That is one thing education officials hate, knowledgeable parents who are below the higher social/economic stratum. They are think we are dumb, lack skills and abilities in reading/writing, and of course lack the ability to reason in complicated issues such as education, and how the other factors in society impacts the education of our children. More or less, they think we cannot chew gum and walk at the same time.
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 8, 2010 21:34:01 GMT -5
Hi Nancy The latest in my situation is the mediation process was suppose to start today. Supposedly the dir of education did not return today as previously stated because she is now on personal leave.The expectation was that we would wait to resolve issues because she is apparently the only one in a very top heavy SD that can make decisions. My response was are you kidding me and NO and they have until Wednesday to come up with someone who can deal with this.
Also we received a letter from the minister of social service's office today that said that the allegation from the dir of ed that we were emotionally abusing our dd has not been reported therefore there is no file opened therefore it will not be investigated. No suprise there I am trying to figure out however how to use the letter to our advantage.
It has been a day and I am determined that I will keep pushing these people.
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Post by therose on Feb 13, 2010 21:43:36 GMT -5
That is puzzling to say the least. On personal leave - can you just phone, or get someone else to phone the office, and a live person on, and ask to speak to the director. When they say no, she is on personal leave, say oh no, when will she be back? If that does not work, try the next one, a direct question, it must be nice to take personal leave half way through the school year, or something like that. Just get them talking, make up any plausible story, and gain their trust. As for the allegation in the letter, take it to a lawyer and see what he has to say about it, because they are accusing you of it but if I remember correctly, it does not state it outright. She could be sue for liable, especially if she said she was going to report it to social services. Even if she did not say it in the letter, she did infer something. I would check with a lawyer, and if it is the case, you could use it to force a meeting without her. Just a threat of a lawyer, and liable would work in your favour. I have done it a few times, over the years, it does work, but it certainly makes them angry.
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 14, 2010 13:11:47 GMT -5
Hi Nancy The dir of ed is on indefinite leave because her SO is very ill. I gave them till Wednesday to come up with a plan for going forward with mediation. They figured it out Tuesday. The mediation meeting is Feb 25th. The SD originally wanted to meet with us before mediation to discuss the new and improved PPP. We said not interested. The SD's team is made up of 2 superintendents, the special ed coordinator, and the vice principal so no one that works directly with my DD. Everyone has their own agenda and the regional dir for SK learning and the SD want this to be about reintegrating her into the school even though they have been repeatedly that is not happening. I received a letter Friday from the super on about how they want to transition DD back and how they will provide off site instruction for 2 core courses and how they would require her to attend the school starting an hour a week for social interaction with her peers. I wrote back that DD needed access to the material in the 4 core courses not 2 and that DD would not be returning to school in the near future. That her relationships with her same age peers consisted of them ignoring her and she them or her being the but of their jokes while they bullied and targeted her which in no way met her need for social interactions.
My feeling is this will be a very short mediation meeting because I am not willing to waste my time listening to all the things they say they will do but won't.
My plan is to drag this out for the rest of the school year while she does her course work at home because she has way more options once she is in high school.
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Post by therose on Feb 14, 2010 21:11:46 GMT -5
That sounds like a good plan. What are the options at the high school level? Just wondering, in this part of the country, there is less options.
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 15, 2010 12:25:38 GMT -5
The options are correspondence, or correspondence for some classes and school for others, the alternate program my son attends[ This would be last choice] or virtual school through the Catholic system The virtual school I will have to wait until tomorrow to phone about because today is a stat holiday here.
It is a matter of waiting them out I hope and because this situation is in the spot light they will hopefully want to appear to be more reasonable.
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Post by lindsy on Feb 15, 2010 15:14:19 GMT -5
Hi Therose and kjgdid Have been lurking reading this thread - you've provided lots of good approaches to the problems that seem to be our experience in Canada.
I have a question for the two of you. I've recently posted my ds scores from his pscy eval which are (sigh) bad. I actually believe he is much more than these scores and that some elements haven't been taken into consideration. Back to my questions - ds has OT eval stating DCD. Psych is in agreement. She thinks I should apply for the disability tax credit under mental impairment portion due to the DCD. I am having a hard time wrapping my mind around having the gov't tag that label onto him - and what repercussions there may be in the future by doing this. What are your thoughts? What about driving, etc? Although I'd love the tax credit (I hope I got the name correct) I'd hate to saddle him with something without really understanding the implications.
thanks
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 15, 2010 17:49:52 GMT -5
Hi Lindsy both my kids have been diagnosed with DCD my daughter in the severe range, my son with moderate DCD. I have not had the Dr fill out the tax credit form for either based on DCD. We get it for our daughter based on PDD-NOS
There are actually 2 programs the first one is my baby bonus was doubled once she was accepted and we went back I think three years and got a cheque for that.
The second is the disability tax credit where you or your spouse who ever claims the child gets an addition 7000 tax credit on income tax. This program you can go back 10 years not 7 depending on the age of the child. If your child is say 11 you can go back to the tax year that he turned 1. You have to apply for this separately. It is a matter of writing a simple letter for both. Th back pay took I think 5 months and we received a cheque for 23000 so quite a nice chunk of change.
The way the professional fills out the form is very important the needs to be a impact in at least one area and I can't remember what they are. If you decide to apply for this let me know and I will look up how the Dr filled out my daughter's
When the child turns 18 they claim for the tax credit.
I do not think being under this program will affect the ability to drive etc.
I believe the program was set up because it was recognized that there is a higher expense to raise these kids.
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Post by kjgdid on Feb 26, 2010 23:45:48 GMT -5
We went to mediation on Thursday. The SD is offering 5 half days a week at a location that is not in the school. 2 x's a week a teacher will go and offer instruction. The special ed coordinator will initially work with my dd to find out what she needs and will then train the EA and help the teacher with programming. We agreed to this plan.It is actually more than we hoped for.
It got quite hot and heavy when I asked the question about the communication process. The SD said no communication between us and them and we said no deal we need to be able to communicate with someone who is actually working directly with our daughter. After an hour of negotiating the SD is going to provide a conference call every Friday.
The regional director for SK learning that attended the meeting pulled my husband aside after the meeting and asked that we call him if we have any trouble with the SD's staff members because he had concerns with a couple of them.
The mediator pulled me aside after the meeting and suggested that I not cc anything to my ministerial cc buddies while we were in truce mode. I replied that I know that one and I reserve those type of emails for when the SD does something illegal or unethical. Though I was disappointed that they did not want to here from me because as my elected officials I would think that they would want to know how their decisions impact on the people they were elected to be the voice for. Then we both laughed.
Now we will see whether the SD actually follows through as that is usually where things go Nova.
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Post by therose on Feb 28, 2010 12:40:26 GMT -5
Congrats on your victory. But what is up with the communication? It is a perverse setup, and not at all helpful in engaging and discussing education topics regarding your daughter. So, it appears to me, as you put it, the elected officials came down hard on the SD staff, and probably for good reason. I don't know if you aware of this, but I have learned that between Manitoba and SK, it is a toss up, which is worse regarding delivery of education, when they refuse to published/released the stats on some common indicators, that would help if their methods are kosher, regarding literacy, numeracy and other important education indicators. I have been busy, exploring this topic, and discovered that among the heavy hitters and researchers in education, they do not think too kindly over these two provinces. Both provinces may not be provinces to go too, if you have a child with special needs. Of course, I piped in that it does not matter which province, being that each offers the bad along with the good, but none offer excellent services toward ALL special needs children. Now back on topic, the elected officials came down hard on SD, and SD is pissed. So to retain a bit of their power, and to keep you under control (in their mind - you are a trouble maker), they have insisted to be the gatekeeper in communications. Sure glad, you insisted on some form of communication, and once a week by telephone will be good enough. SD agreed to it, thinking they will be able to bring your guard down. While you are going to allow them to think that, and abide by the communication process. Bring up your concerns and any good things on the weekly telephone calls, and let them continued to think that way. Meanwhile, take a brand new notebook out, and starting now daily record the process as it unfolds. Include any conversations that your daughter brings your way, in the course of her school days. Sometime kids, will bring you information that you would never find out, unless you are present. It should only take you a few moments of your day to do this. This log, will come in handy, in the event of a dispute, and when it is time to write to your ministerial buddies. I have no doubt that SD will carry through, but the question will they carry through with the spirit and best interests of the child or will it be a half-hearted attempt to appease? The log book can be useful, in looking for patterns and will show the progress of your daughter. Of course, it is a more reliable method to keep your memories, your viewpoints of the past, present into perspective. Remember, they are counting that you will not continue on with your advocate ways, that shows that seamier side of education. In fact, the communication ploys are used across the country to get parents to comply. In NL, there is stories of parents being barred from the school, for raising their voices, and it taken as a threat. Parents who have children with some type of special needs, have often become the victim of communication ploys. The last time it was done to me, where my telephone calls went unreturned, they regretted it, since then. The only lasting side effect, is a few teachers in the elementary end, will not engage with me in small time conversation, outside of an education environment. They still peeve off at me, for directing criticism in their general direction. This is one of the biggest reasons to start a blog, or a site where people of special needs children can go to in Canada. We have no place to go to, except the individual organizations, and in many cases not at all helpful dealing with education. We need something to call our own, and where all parents can connect, learn and talk about education issues. In Canada we are too isolate, and more so because of the education system is set up. To leave off, the link below is an American researcher whose field is in cognitive psychology. Scroll down the page, to the article - How Can I Help Slow Learners. At the end there is a short video clip titled, Famous Failures. I think you will enjoy that. The second link is more of the same researcher, various articles on cognitive research. blog.coreknowledge.org/author/dan-willingham/www.britannica.com/blogs/author/dwillinghamSo once again, congrats and I do hope that your husband and yourself, took the time out to celebrate this victory.
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Post by kjgdid on Mar 1, 2010 15:36:32 GMT -5
Hi Nancy I am getting indicators that there is something up with this SD and specifically with this school.I hope that it is a matter of when you sign a light on something bad it gets cleaned up.
The log book is a wonderful idea and I will follow through on that.
In terms of the communication the reasons change often. I think it is more of a SD decision because they do not want us to communicate with their front line staff not because of what we say but because of what they inadvertently tell us. What ever my child will not be in environment where her parents are criminalized are marginalized because it is not in her best interest.
We will also see if they follow through on what they say they will do and for how long.
Their intentions are to provide this until the heat is off and then back to the same old that is not happening this time.
I will explore the links later today thanks Karen
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Post by therose on Mar 2, 2010 8:44:26 GMT -5
The front line staff, are often not the problem. For many of us though, we perceived them as part of the problem. Front line staff, have union demands, principals demands, and within a system that is a maze of bureaucratic red tape. Most teachers see it for what it is, but do little about it, because it causes too much grief on their side. Sounds to me, that what might be at play, is that prior to the meeting, there was a lot of kicking the problem around and casting blame at the school level. From what I have read, is that often when the lower levels of any organization is micro-managed to the extreme, it is a system where problems that originate from the lower levels, can be kick around from one level to the next, without ever having to address the problem. The type of problems that are not address, are problems originating from rules/regulations designed to keep costs down. At the very top of the organization, such as the ministry of education, they are unlikely to learn of problems that exist at the lower levels, that exist because of the cost-savings measures imposed from the ministry, and of course the ministry's administration is design to look at the macro rather than the micro. When the top level of an organization hear about problems, they usually go after the middle management, and not the lower levels, because they are just following the rules. It is middle management that implements policy, rules/regulations and to ensure that the lower level are following them within their perceived parameters, and not necessarily the parameters of the ministry. I believe parents of special needs, should be aware of the operations of schools, and how policy flows through the various channels. Often, not being aware of the influences, it makes it more difficult for parents to access special services and to obtain services.
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Post by kjgdid on Mar 3, 2010 10:17:49 GMT -5
I tend to agree that the front line staff are generally not the problem. I understand from other professionals that work with in the school but not part of the division that the school is a very difficult environment to work in there are 2 distinct groups of teachers and the staff room is a toxic environment which is ruled by the in group that is close to the administration.The new teachers either go along with the established program or leave. This school has a high teacher turn over. One telling example that I will share is across the street from the school is a ambulance only parking spot since we moved here the principle parked in that spot consistently everyday no one else just him up until this year now that he is out of favor with the division office the vice principal parks there.
The SD team and the regional dir of children's services met all morning with the mediator before we got there in the afternoon. The plan that they came up with had totally changed from Tuesday to Thursday when we met.
I have worked in some capacity in human services for over 2o years now one of my observations is when the environment is set up to serve the needs of care givers rather than the clients the environment becomes dysfunctional. This is the case with this SD division and it becomes easier to blame the child and the parent than fix the problem. In our specific case the school team is being blamed for the situation and being dismissed from participating or making any decisions about our child. That is all being done at the division level now.
The reason for the no direct contact order is not what we say to the teachers but what they inadvertently share with us. It was very uncomfortable at that mediation meeting for everybody who was not on the SD team when it was made clear how frightened these people are of displeasing the dir of ed rather than doing the right thing and meeting the needs of the child. Everyone one of the SD team members at that meeting made a choice at some point in their careers to drink the kool- aide rather than stand up for what is right.
In our case I believe if I was to send dd back to school tomorrow I could pretty much guarantee that on paper she would be doing exceptionally well both academically and socially and every effort would be made to convince both her and us that this was reality but it would not be.
I do not want my dd in that toxic environment.
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Post by therose on Mar 4, 2010 13:53:44 GMT -5
I have a little problem that cropped up yesterday, where I had to take a stand. Right now, it appears that no at the school level or above, are not concern the actions that I undertook yesterday. I did not even rate a phone, to confirm the process of course selection. Actually, course selection has been on my mind for some time, and my concerns lie with the process and the parameters used to select courses. In that last 2 weeks or so, reported by my daughter, and others, in conversations of the actual process. I became alarm at what I had seen as a discriminatory practice against students who either have a special need, or the students who are not academically inclined students, and have averages in the 50s or 60s, and in some cases failing averages. The process, is that each teacher call mentors, have 8 to 10 grade 9 students, who apparently will help each student to select the correct course and level. Than the 8 to 10 students meet in the classroom, where each course is explain, and than the next step is selection of courses. It is where one student comes up to the front, to speak to the mentor, about their selections, while the rest of the students are in the back of classroom, within earshot of what is being discuss between the mentor and the one students. I guess you can well imagine, few students are going to argue with the mentor, with having 7 to 9 students as the audience. Upon hearing that, along with the earlier news that all students who have learning problems are to take basic courses (new term this year, now being called applied courses), I decided to take action at that point. You might wonder where do parents come into the equation, at a later meeting, arrange at night, where the parents come in with their kid's form, courses selection and meet as a whole group. How much do you want to bet, there is pressure to sign the form than and there, without debating with the mentors or questioning their wisdom. As parents we are given to March 10 to signed the form, and for parents who children with an IEP, final approval goes to the district board. How much do you want to bet, that a child like mine, will be taken out of the academic stream, to be put into basic courses, and that is based, if I had succeeded to jumped the hoops at the school level. In this high school, there is only two streams now, applied and academic. Advance courses are available for grade 11 and 12, but are only provided through long-distance education. Advance courses would include courses such as forensic science, and where they do not have the resources or the necessary qualified teacher to teach the course. After researching the education site for any rules regarding course selection, and the process, which I did not find, except in one area, regarding exceptions and how a student can advance from applied to academic. If a student followed that, it would add an extra two years of high school, and it is no guarantee that they will become good readers, and writers. Nor will it ensure a spot at the local college, where applied courses is another version of basic, disguise as special education. No where did I read a rule, saying all students with learning problems are to take basic (applied courses) only. I check the school board site, of course I found no information what so ever. I concluded that the board was behind the process, the setup of the process, where schools can avoid having any discussions with parents, and it really did not matter in their eyes, because final decision rest with the school, regardless of what the students or parents wanted. Than I called the school, to no avail of reaching any teacher or the principal. I wanted to confirm the process, but all staff apparently were gone by 3:30. So, I told the secretary, that I want a phone call today, confirming what is the process, and if I do not received a phone call, I will assume my understanding of the process is the correct one, and my daughter will not participate in a process that is highly discriminatory, and rigged where her concerns or her parents are secondary to the advice of the mentors (teachers), and in my case, where final approvals rests with the district board, who are the same ones that have continued to ignore my daughter's needs. The next phone call was to the ministry's office to inform them about what is going on. I still waiting for a phone call, from them - when is the 64 dollar question, since the new education ministry is the same person, who told me my daughter will always be slow back in grade 1, and this reason was their basis to denied a psycho-educational assessment . He insisted that she did not have LD, she was just slow. Since grade 4 and the advent of her having being identified as LD, he has avoided me at all costs, in the school setting or a social setting. Now that he is the big cheese in the education minister, I see he has been putting his doctorate in education administration to good use. He has been busy changing not only the site, rendering it completely unfriendly for those who do not have high skills in reading and deductive reasoning, he has also change many of the processes, where parents and their children are written out of the education processes. I still have my contacts within the ministry, and everyone knows what had transpired back in the primary grades with my daughter, and presently the class of 95', sitting in grade 9 where 60 % of the kids have weak skills in part or all of reading, writing and numeracy. The chickens are finally roosting, I do hope my contacts have observed this phenomenal, that it is unique and shows in every school across the district, for children born in and around the year 1995. I don't dare mentioned it, but since the removal of pertinent stats regarding groupings in ages were removed at the school, board and province-wide, which is evidence to support my position, I can no longer work at this angle. The removal was done sometime in January, and no doubt was removed, where he has access to my letters that were written a few years ago, regarding the increasing rate of of poor literacy in our students. Even though changes have been made to prevent the slide, the changes did not impact the students who are born in and around the year 1995. I was checkmate, while my back was turn, as I discovered yesterday, but I guess he might be wondering why over half of the class did not go to school today to participate in course selection. Once the parents found out what I was doing, via through the mega-horn of my daughter, they too elected not to show up. I just hope that they understand why I was doing it, but it appears that kids should be able to take the courses that they want, to be able to have a crack at it, and decide for themselves that it might be best to go and take applied courses, or at least this is what I heard in the gossip around town. This is the third time, that a good proportion of the parents have followed my lead, in two different situations. One of them, I refuse to sign the shop form, where I release the school from all liability. They finally had to produce forms without the attachment releasing them from any liability. So, I don't know what the next step will be but I got the rest of the weekend to think about it since there is no school tomorrow. Hopefully, I can get it resolved, without too much trouble, and not ruffling anybody's feathers in the process.
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Post by kjgdid on Mar 5, 2010 11:22:29 GMT -5
How horrible. I agree that this a discriminatory practice and to have to present in front of others is not only undignified and manipulative but wrong. Why are these children not being given the same opportunity as others? The message being given is because they are to stupid to be in the regular courses. All of this is very wrong how dare they decide that they will limit someones future. What I would do at this point is if I did not receive a phone call back from the school or Ministry office I would write a letter to the Minister ccing the principle, dir of ed and school board the provincial obudsmen,basically anyone you can think of at the governmental level who had an interest in this matter even if it is remote asking that the minister's office investigate immediately and get back to you in no later than 2 weeks because time is of an essence. In the letter cite the charter of rights and freedom, human rights code, the school board policy and the ministry's own documents regarding the rights of the child and the steps you have taken to get this resolved i.e. called the school and the minister's office. I would explain in the letter why you are unwilling to follow this discriminatory practice and sit back and wait for a response. If the minister's office does not get back to you within 2 weeks bump it up citing the lack of interest of the minister's office again ccing everyone on your list. Eventually you will get a response. Good luck and please let me know what happens with this.
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Post by therose on Mar 6, 2010 1:38:43 GMT -5
Hi Karen, The minister's office called, second level in special supports. She wants me to contact the school, come Monday, and arrange a meeting. I said I would do it, and than she interrupted me, I know Nancy, I can tell in your voice, you do not think it would do much good. She than reassure me, and get back to her, if it has not been resolved. During the conversation, I pointed out there is the final approval by the regional district board for anyone having an IEP. This was duly noted. She added there is no such policy at the ministry level, that states anyone with a 'learning problem' must take basic. I than tooted in, this could be the reason why the population growth in basic courses are hitting close to 40 %. She told me, they are at the 40 % mark as of now. I also pointed out, that if a student took basic in math and english, and the student improved, it would add two more years of high school. The hoops one has to go through to climb into the other level, academic is rather a twisted route. We talk about a lot of the things directly related to my daughter's LD, but I had also given her a piece of information, that she did not that it was regular practice done by the elementary school. It is the practice of giving out the reading material prior to being assessed, so the student is able to make a passing grade. The practice has not stop, and from my observations, it is common and is given to students who are having reading problems, but are not failing grade wise. So, in my opinion the new changes that have been made, the schools are still not picking up most of the kids who are either struggling in some part of the reading process, or actually do have a learning disability. Plus, I also threw in the reading assessments conducted by school, where my daughter has passed them all, and the other assessments that can be retrieved on the net, where it would show that she is 2 reading grades below where she should be, plus other weaknesses. In the end they recommendations to see a reading specialist, or something along this line. But she had aha moment, and I bet she thinking could this be the reason, why there is not a larger grade 1 and 2 population taking the new interventions that have been put in place at the primary grades. So, I will proceed to make the appointment, and add the Charter, human rights, ministry policy, and than add sweetly, since there is no information at the board level, except that the board's responsibility is to shape the deliver program that meets the ministry's mandate, among the other responsibilities to ensure that it meets the Charter and human rights. I also instructed my daughter, to get on the horn, and find out what exactly happen on Thursday, and at night time, with the parents. From what she heard so far, a large turnout, and many passed the forms in with their signatures. If that happen, there was quite a few parents felt obligated to hand them in, especially when the parents who are at a higher social ranking do so willingly. But than again, their kids are doing well for various reasons. All the other children who have been identified either formally or informally, come from the low income group, except for my daughter. I am the lone parent, to insist on an assessment from day 1, and have been fighting since than. I am not from Newfoundland originally, I was born and raised in Ontario. I was raised with a different outlook, it is not how much you earn, what levels of education you have, but it is how you live your life. I saw that kind of thinking for the most part right throughout the community while I was growing up. Our family, or really my mother was, became a favourite among the wealthy Americans that came to their summer mansions , shortly after school was over. The kids, benefited from their kindness, of almost new, hardly ever been worn, clothing, and top of the line. The kids at school sometimes wonder why I could wear such expensive clothing, being a farmer's kid, and when they found out, the kids were more interested about the rich kids and the mansions they lived in, with butler and maids. I became popular, because I knew some important wealthy kids, until I brought them down that these kids also have chores to do around the house, and even than, they still wanted to meet them. In the community where I live, it was not the size of your wallet book, but how how you lived your life. Here in the community that I am living in, it is your size of your wallet that is more important, and the second factor is the social ranking. Enough of the rambling that I seem to fawn of, once I have the info regarding Thursday, than on Sunday, I get cracking on my notes, so I have a script to rely on, and not get off track when it comes to the appointment. No doubt my little telephone chat will be discuss at that level, and they will get a follow up letter very soon, once I do the research on the administration operations of an entity, in this case it the public education system, and how each relates and their various duties. Now that I have had some reflection on this matter, the school board and the minister site, has moved into a more business like form, and from what I have read, policies have gone down that road of business. I have read quite a bit about school systems in the last 2 years, that run on a business model, and a lot of people are against it for various reasons. I have to refresh my memories on that, and than start connecting the practices occurring at the school level, to the school board and how it twists the ministry's mandates or policies. I already have 5 small practices in my head, by the end of the week, I should have 20 or so. Hopefully, all 20 will directly connect and influence the measurements and achievement rates that the ministry loves to follow. Thanks for the tips, I was lost what would be my next move, besides making the phone call. Even my kid was bugging me today what I was going to do next, and I told her you should be happy getting a 4 day weekend off, and give it a rest.
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Post by kjgdid on Mar 6, 2010 11:46:06 GMT -5
Hi Nancy Having a meeting in a good idea and taking a script of what you want to talk about is even better. I would suggest taking someone with you to take notes of the conversation. Then I would suggest writing a letter of this is my understanding of what was discussed at the meeting if it was not your understanding please get back to me in x days letter and sending it to the school, school board and person you spoke to at the ministers office. Good luck. Karen
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Post by kjgdid on Apr 1, 2010 16:10:00 GMT -5
Hi Nancy I was just wondering how you were and if everything was alright Karen
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