Coffee as stimulant for Inattentive ADD?

[snapplema]

I found an interesting article here:
www.primarilyinattentiveadd.com/2009/12/coffee-why-it-helps.html


Quote:
"...
-5 oz cup of ground brewed coffee contains 85 mg of caffeine
-Instant coffee contains 60 mg of caffeine
-Decaf coffee contains 3 mg of caffeine.

...Caffeine is considered safe in doses as high as 400mg for adults and 250mg for children..."

So,::: If 1 6oz cup of brewed coffee contains about 100 mg of caffeine and 250mg dose of caffeine is considered safe for children - then before considering any medications perhaps I should just give my 12 year old son a cup of coffee in the morning to get him going?

Could the solution be THAT simple ??

Has anyone ever tried that?

[empeg1]

My dd has ADHD-I and she tells me that coffee relaxes her. The only time she can drink coffee is at night before bed.

[michellea]

I have heard that coffee can help kids focus. That said, part of the benefit of a stimulant drug is that the delivery system is tweaked so that the drug moves through the system in a more even, controlled and predictable manner. Caffeine is a substance that is metabolized irregularly, and may be difficult to "control" in some ways.

What I am saying is that it might not be that simple for a number of reasons. It may help to some degree, but there are many good reasons to seek professional help and regulated medications if that is indeed what your child needs.

There have been studies that have shown that nicotine has a similar effect and that the probability of people using and becoming addicted to tobacco products is higher than the general population as they seek and find some relief from smoking, chewing or what ever.

[Mayleng]

Coffee may give us a boost in the morning, it does not stay long or consistenly, it is not a treatment plan for ADHD/In. Pls talk to a doctor about medication, treatment plans etc. If it was that simple, don't you think all of us would have been doing it by now? Don't you think that would be the first line of treatment the doctors use to treat ADHD? Don't you think all the newspapers and tv networks would be talking about this miracle cure? Most of us here on this board have been on this road for many years, trust us when we say we have tried most everything and for me personally, medication and structure has been the single most effective thing for my son.

Plus you could get addicted to coffee, as I surely am.

[snapplema]

EPIC FAIL ==OR WAS IT A SUCCESS?, LOL

Well, call me crazy, but it's Saturday morning, and I thought I give it a try. My son was always interested in trying coffee from my cup, but was not allowed. So this morning I made a cup of coffee for him, too (I make rather weak coffee anyway).

I thought it's the week-end, it's morning - I'll let him have a cup of coffee and then ask him to do his homework and we'll see it he does better. Well, so the cup of coffee was sitting in front of him, he was surprised "Is this real coffee for me FOR REAL?" - he took two small sips and that's it.

He had some water instead. And this whole cup of coffee is still on the table! He didn't even feel like drinking it! He told me "Mom, you were right, coffee doesn't really taste that good" (I was always telling him that coffee doesn't taste so good, it is just that adults drink it out of a habit).

So my good intentions and advice backfired at the time of this experiment!


Kids usually want to do things they are not allowed to do - but once they are allowed to do something - they lose interest.

I think perhaps it is not that coffee would not help some inattentive kids - it might be that how on earth are you going to make your kid drink a whole cup? ==and why would you? That would be like totally bad influence.

I agree that when a kid is 12, it would be much easier and politically correct to make sure he swallows a pill prescribed by a doctor.

for this idea // but the fact is that I am allergic to quite a few medications and cannot stomach some others, so I worry my kid might have similar problems with real meds for ADD //

[healthy11]

snapplema, have you seen more of the comments that have been made to your earlier question about medications for ADHD-inattentive? I wouldn't automatically assume that your son would have the same reactions as you to meds. My son, for example, does fine on Adderall, although he's allergic to amoxicilin, and neither my husband nor I have problems with that.

As far as caffeine, my ADHD son can drink coffee and says he feels no effects. From what I can gather, a cup of instant coffee has about 80mg caffeine; you may not realize it, but some soda pops, like Pepsi Max and Mountain Dew, have quite high amounts, too. Heck, even Sunkist Orange is supposed to have about 40. (You can do a "google search" for caffeine content comparisons) If you really wanted to try it, the so-called "Energy" drinks like Monster, which are popular among teens/young adults, contain far higher amounts of caffeine than a single cup of coffee.

[Mayleng]

I think there have been quite a few articles on those so call energy drinks, about them not being healthy, and bad of teens. Caffeine crashes are not good either.

[healthy11]

I'm definitely not advocating for energy drinks, but trying to point out that just because someone doesn't drink coffee, doesn't mean they won't get caffeine in other ways.

[snapplema]

Thank you for your replies.

We don't keep any sodas in our house, mainly because of their high sugar content. I do not get anything with artificial sweeteners, either as I believe they are not healthy.

I sometimes make tea or tea with lemon for my kid - usually not sweetened - but even if I put sugar there it's not much, just 1 teaspoon is enough.

I forgot to mention that we try to ear mostly organic food and that I refused to take any medication when I was pregnant because I believed it was in the best interest of my child. I didn't have any coffee or alcohol either.

So it's funny that now I have to consider coffee or medication for my son, and if it helps it would be a lifesaver.

Anyway, I will make another effort to obtain an IEE for my son again. Then, once he has some kind of IEP in place, and he stays on it for a couple of months- then we will go to see his doctor about trial meds.

I came across coffee idea while searching internet for more info about Inattentive ADD.

I might have a memory problem myself, -or-maybe I am too optimistic, but during vacation I tend to forget what we were going through before and always hope that this time things will be different.

Over the week-end I had to sit down with my ds to organize his binder and make him study again and again I got this sinking feeling that nothing has changed. Each time there is some mental effort required of him (and it was really a minimum effort- like re-writing a sentence here or there or putting a date in) , he gets all those aches and pains, stomach pains, he's complaining of feeling itchy, he has to go to the bathroom, his hands sweat...I asked him if his hand hurts when he writes, he answered that it doesn't. I do not understand : Is it a sign that he is not focused, is it because he cannot comprehend something (but then what we were doing was very simple and I believe he understood everything), or is it because he hates notebooks/writing.? He also had to write a paragraph and it was full of spelling mistakes, but I was so exhausted after making him fix/organize his binder that I didn't have any more energy left to have him fix the paragraph.

I noticed that what is also happening is I am losing my energy and maybe getting depressed about this whole situation. It hangs over me all the time as something unresolved and affects my work as well.

In the end I might be the one who also need coffee or meds.

And then ds got interested in joining the army and this is his first major interest and I know he will not be accepted with ADD and all his problems and I was about to tell him "so start doing things right and fast" and then I think perhaps I shouldn't because if it is a condition he cannot control, then what's the point?

[healthy11]

Sharie001's son with ADHD and writing difficulties joined the military after H.S. (He actually ended up getting a GED.) I believe the military wants candidates to have not taken medication for a year prior to enlistment. In Sharie's son's case, he was always very athletic, and found that the intense physical workouts that the military puts kids through was enough to help his focus. His difficulties were more pronounced when having to sit at a desk in a school setting, not "out in the field," so he did fine, and recently returned home from a tour in Iraq: millermom.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Private&action=display&thread=11030

I know you're reluctant to try medications, but if your son is struggling so much now, it seems wise to first consider how how he can be more successful in high school, before worrying about what he'll do after it.

[snapplema]

That's interesting. So there is hope some things will change and in that case, I am glad I didn't say anything.

As I said, I am at the point that I have accepted tha fact that we have no other choice but to try medications.

And you are right again that it does make more sense to think about the present rather than worry about the future - but I can't separate one from another.

Every parent thinks and talks about the future to their children. "Study and you will go to a good college and get a good job in the future", "If you don't do your homework, you will never accomplish anything in your life and your friends will become doctors and you will be sweeping the floor at Walmart"..."Do you want to become homeless?", LOL. We sometimes say all those things, hoping this would make our kids stop and think about their future and try harder.

The future is what scares me because I worry how will my son manage details of his life, how will he be able to make money and support himself, how will he be able to make the right choices, pick right friends, what will he do if he is not able to get a good education & go to college?". I am aware there are other jobs and possibilities but don't they all require that one actually does a GOOD JOB?....Of course, I keep on telling myself that things can change/improve, college is not everything, and Jay Leno story and so on....But still, I can't help thinking about it.

[Mayleng]

Over the week-end I had to sit down with my ds to organize his binder and make him study again and again I got this sinking feeling that nothing has changed. Each time there is some mental effort required of him (and it was really a minimum effort- like re-writing a sentence here or there or putting a date in) , he gets all those aches and pains, stomach pains, he's complaining of feeling itchy, he has to go to the bathroom, his hands sweat...I asked him if his hand hurts when he writes, he answered that it doesn't. I do not understand : Is it a sign that he is not focused, is it because he cannot comprehend something (but then what we were doing was very simple and I believe he understood everything), or is it because he hates notebooks/writing.? He also had to write a paragraph and it was full of spelling mistakes, but I was so exhausted after making him fix/organize his binder that I didn't have any more energy left to have him fix the paragraph.

I noticed that what is also happening is I am losing my energy and maybe getting depressed about this whole situation. It hangs over me all the time as something unresolved and affects me

This is exactly what it was like when my son did homework when he was younger and unmedicated. We had lots and lots of tears, his and mine. Since being put on medication and giving him a routine and structure, he does his homework by himself. It is not going to happen immediately, but it should get better. It takes time.

I suggest you get this book A Bird's-Eye View of Life with ADD and ADHD: Advice from Young Survivors www.chrisdendy.com/

I might have a memory problem myself, -or-maybe I am too optimistic, but during vacation I tend to forget what we were going through before and always hope that this time things will be different.

This is call being in denial, which many go thru' before they start seeking help for their kids. It is important to get help early when the kids at least would listen to us and do what we ask. Once they get to be teenagers, it is so much harder because the hormones come into play and they start rebelling. I trully believe my son's success is partly due to being diagnosed early and getting treatment early. He understand his ADHD very well, and was able to tell me what works and what doesn't for both medication and strategies for school and for studying. His ADHD has never defined him. Until we discovered what it was, he had always felt stupid. But once he found out what it was, strangely he felt better about himself. ADHD is part of who he is and we work together to overcome and make him successfull. It is a full time job. As I mentioned in my earlier post. He is a freshmen in high school. He has plans to work in Asia, he asked me what he needs to get there and I told him probably an MBA. For now he says he wants to work towards an MBA, and has already picked out a college and wants to take Finance related electives next yr in High School. This may change as I told him, but this is extremely rare for ADHD kids at this age to actually plan ahead. Not just saying I want to be something when I grow up, but to actually plan how he is going to do it, since executive functions are always somewhat impaired with ADHD/IN kids.
Hell! his neurotypical older brother who is applying to colleges now, does not think that far ahead. Not many kids do.
But really rare for an ADHDer to do that, especially when they don't love school or the boredom of school.

So if you get treatment early, teach him organization, his strengths and weakness, think ahead, let him feel some success instead of constant failures (because that is the one thing that will doom a kid). Why even try when you keep failing!
This is a long road it does not end when they finish college, I doubt it ever ends. But the best we can do is prepare them and help them when we still can to be ready to be on their own.
Medication is not just about getting them to do well academically, it is also to help them navigate life, socially as well.

[snapplema]

"...I suggest you get this book A Bird's-Eye View of Life with ADD and ADHD: Advice from Young Survivors www.chrisdendy.com/..."

I have this book! I have purchased a few books on organization and I have been giving organizational "tips" to my son for years (if he only took advantage of my good advice!). We have boards and post-its and I have color-marked subjects and so on...So it is there, the problem is that he forgets it's there even though it is usually right in front of him.

Last month I also got this book "Help" I'm in Middle schools..How will I survive" which has lots of good information and tips and was written for kids entering Middle School. It's not specifically for ADHD kids, but still most organizational /other tips and info is the same. This book is short and with some drawings so he read it with interest (no results yet-though)

I might have a memory problem myself, -or-maybe I am too optimistic, but during vacation I tend to forget what we were going through before and always hope that this time things will be different.

"...This is call being in denial, which many goes thru' before they start seeking help for their kids.[/quote][/i]..."

Yes, it's that as well. I was helping my son a lot hoping that would be enough. Now I understand I still have to help my son, and my help is necessary but it is not enough, he needs more than that. Apparently, some mother's work is never done.

[Mayleng]

I think all mother's work is never done. I have more problems getting my Neurotypical 17 yr old son to do anything than my ADHDer. My ADHDer is my easy child once I got him the help he needed. My 17 yr old neuroptypical is just spoilt, lazy and self absorbed. Sigh!

Why medication is important is it hopefully will give your son the ability to learn. You can teach him all the organization tricks, give him aids etc all you want (as you have experienced) but he won't remember to use them. The meds allows him to focus and remember.

[healthy11]

I KNOW a mother's work is never done! (Or maybe it's that the worrying never stops?) Somehow, most get through...all we can do is take one day at a time!! ( Where is that smiley tearing her hair out?? LOL!)

[cecekingskid]

Oct 4, 2010 10:15:52 GMT -5 snapplema said:

I might have a memory problem myself, -or-maybe I am too optimistic, but during vacation I tend to forget what we were going through before and always hope that this time things will be different.

Over the week-end I had to sit down with my ds to organize his binder and make him study again and again I got this sinking feeling that nothing has changed. Each time there is some mental effort required of him (and it was really a minimum effort- like re-writing a sentence here or there or putting a date in) , he gets all those aches and pains, stomach pains, he's complaining of feeling itchy, he has to go to the bathroom, his hands sweat...I asked him if his hand hurts when he writes, he answered that it doesn't. I do not understand : Is it a sign that he is not focused, is it because he cannot comprehend something (but then what we were doing was very simple and I believe he understood everything), or is it because he hates notebooks/writing.? He also had to write a paragraph and it was full of spelling mistakes, but I was so exhausted after making him fix/organize his binder that I didn't have any more energy left to have him fix the paragraph.

I noticed that what is also happening is I am losing my energy and maybe getting depressed about this whole situation. It hangs over me all the time as something unresolved and affects my work as well.

I think most of us can relate to the feeling of being overwhelmed and consumed with the seemingly unending job of not just raising a child, but raising a child with add / ld etc.

Personally, I often feel like my dd's ADD is the center of my world. Especially when it comes to advocating or researching ways to help.

I recently realized that I was researching and find a BOATLOAD of information on ways to help, books to read, programs to implement, strategies to utilize...but in all my finding I wasn't implementing anything. This was because after the research and pouring over books and forums, and the internet for hours on end there was no time lift to actually activate any of the methods I'd learned about.

Since I often wonder if I suffer from ADD myself I found that what helped me /us was for me to actually put myself on a schedule and stick to it. Meaning that I only allow myself a certain amount of time during the week to research online. And I schedule time to work with DD on things that actually require me to be present with her. Trust me I've tried it. But Its not enough to say here's a whiteboard and a calendar and an agenda - make use of these. You have to model using these tools sometimes on a daily basis until it sticks and becomes automatic for them. Which could take weeks.

Now, even when I find new information or a new method my first inclination may be to try to put it into practice right away but i know better. First thing I need to do is decide: "Does this speak to dd's most pressing issue?" If it does then I know I need to implement ASAP. If it doesn't and it can take more of a back seat. Then it goes on a list or the website gets bookmarked - or I put a task on my calendar for followup at a later date. This is the only way I can keep some level of sanity.

I'm sure others here can chime in. And perhaps this deserves a seperate thread, but I just wanted to let you know that I learned the hard way that if I wasn't organized with the way I went about things I could preach organization to dd until the cows come home and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans.

I don't know if my way is the best way -- I would actually love to hear from others on how they go about keeping this topic from enveloping their life in its entirety.

[Mayleng]

You have to model using these tools sometimes on a daily basis until it sticks and becomes automatic for them. Which could take weeks.

This is key, modelling and to get them to physically do it so they can remember. Like organizing their backpacks, writing down things etc. They need to do it physically, you can't tell them and then do it. THEY have to do it. And it will take months, not weeks. You will still have to ocassionally remind them and checkup on them.

I ask my son every single day "do you have homework", "do you have any tests to study for", "have you done your homework", and I used to check every day. Still some things fall thru' the cracks. But it gets better year to year. His teachers have been good about communicating with me, but not all. It is good once in a while to write to all his teachers and ask if your child is keeping up with his homework and assignments especially when you don't hear from them. No news does not mean good news. It's to late to hear from the teachers when the child has already failed or almost failing.

Cece, you are so right when you say "Its not enough to say here's a whiteboard and a calendar and an agenda - make use of these."

[healthy11]

cecekingskid, I do think it would be good to copy/paste your thoughts and start a new discussion, for more feedback!

[snapplema]

Sure, I have to admit that I am not following through with everything all the time. I am human. I had an idea for the boards (one for schedule and one for "things to do"), I explained it and we did them, sort of ehm...together. Then I am reminding him every day a few times to look at the boards, to do things that need to be done, to add to the "To do" list. But that's not enough. I cannot just send him to look at the boards because I don't know he will look or not. I have to physically go with him and ask, "so, what do you have to do today", Have you done it? Where is it? (then help him find it - since he can never find anything).

I can't just tell him to do this homework- I have to actually make him sit down, make sure he has all pencils pens he needs, make sure he writes in the right notebook, make sure he knows what he is writing about (he will "do" something even if he doesn't have a clue what he is doing and say nothing and not ask for help). I have to be with him every little step of the way. Since it's been going on for years, that is so exhausting! This year is really hard for me.

Especially that I have my own job that I have to finish in the evenings.

I have never been a happy multi-tasker. When a few things remained to be done, I was doing the count down and I had a big feeling of relief when I was done and nothing was remaining on my "unfinished" list. I have never been good at arguing either (I would rather break up with a guy than confront him, LOL) and now there is a ton of things that are undone, my tasks, my kid's tasks, and I have to MAKE him do things which feels like almost confrontation for me since it doesn't look like he is happy and willing to do what he has to do.

So I am finding myself in a situation that I have to handle, but I have to admit I don't feel comfortable in it. Making someone do something just totally goes against my personality and I cannot always do this job with a cheerful approach. Sometimes I whine "I have told you this a million times and we have just talked about it yesterday and again, today you didn't do it!". And then I am sorry I said those things.

And I worry that he will probably remember me as that forever nagging mother. But if I don't nag and don't force him to study- he will not be able to manage on his own. What a Catch 22!

[sleepy]

Coffee - my daughter's friend. Not for inattention, but to wake up in the morning. She used to struggle to fall asleep, and we resorted to coffee in the morning starting in 5th grade. Actually her teacher told her to have some before school as a joke, but since I started drinking coffee at a young age, I didn't mind so much that my daughter had dome. A child asleep on the desk learns nothing. An awake child has a much better chance of learning something. But this did nothing for the inattention. Nothing.

As for getting kids to learn organizational strategies. I had good success with my daughter and wish I knew the same strategies when my son was younger. Partly, my daughter has a different personality and a different issue than my son, but I know, deep down, I approached my son's organization incorrectly.
Here is what I do for my daughter. To start the process I started asking open ended questions, where are your assignments recorded, what do you need to do the assignment, etc Then it progressed to what do you need to ask yourself before you sit down to work on this? Eventually, she learned to self question more.

[cecekingskid]

Sleepy, yes!!!! These kids inherently have trouble with "self-questioning". Self-talk in general. Where as you and I talk ourselves through the better portion of our day without even thinking about it. It's so so important to put the questions to them in this manner. Over and over again.

Hugs (((snapplema))) I know it’s hard and I can hear the frustration level that you are obviously dealing with right now. As a single parent, I can speak to how keyed up one can become and how easy it would be to just fly off half cocked and enter into a screaming match on some of these things. I'm not always perfect in that respect I will admit. However, I have come to realize a few things that I know to be the TRUTH.

I'm going to try to say this as gently as possible because I want you to be able to receive the point of what I am trying to say to you. Know that I say all of this in love and out of a genuine understanding of what you are going through and a desire to help.

I want to let you know that as the parent, YOU have control of this situation. You may not feel like you do but nonetheless, this is the truth. You still have the power to make or break this situation; this kid. You speak about the type of person that you are; you seem to know yourself and your own shortcomings very well. That's good. Thats a start. But to some extent, in order to help your son, you may have to bend.

First thing that you must realize is that your son most likely is just as frustrated and at his wits end as you are. Its likely he has issues with Executive Functioning, very prevalent with our type of kids, which precludes him from doing some of the very things that you point out about him. I'm not sure how much you know about the topic but, until I learned about it I would often refer to my kid as "just plain hardheaded". I just thought she didn't want to listen to me. I thought she was choosing to disobey.

I have done this before and beaten myself up about it later. When you say things like, "I have told you this a million times," etc....imagine how your child internalizes these comments? Image the self talk that takes place inside his head. How he feels hearing this from you, knowing that he is powerless to fix it because he doesn't know how. He doesn’t understand why he does /does not do the thing you are asking him about. Its sounds as thought he has had to develop defense mechanisms and walk around trying to feign "normalcy" throughout his lifetime. Thats how these kids learn to cope. Can you now imagine why you would do things such as like you mentioned ""do" something even if he doesn't have a clue what he is doing and say nothing and not ask for help" ? He does need help - desperately. Acting as though he knows what he is doing when he doesn't is a cover. It is a defense. Its called “trying to stay under the radar”.

You can make the decision today to start fresh with your son. You may not have it in you to be a "happy multi-tasker" or confront people, but you are a mother. And as a mom, I know that you certainly have it in you to be a safe-haven. To be a place where your son can let his guard down and begin to get honest with himself and with you about where he is falling short and helping to come up with ways that might help. It may come down to being open and honest about yourself (to a degree) and where you have fallen short. There is most likely some semblance of a wall there now. But I know thatyou can begin to pick away at that wall by offering up some heartfelt understanding to your boy. Letting him know that you know he wants to do things "right and fast".

I know this thread was related to caffeine and you may not have been looking for this type of input. I just hear so much of myself (way back when 3 years ago) in your descriptions. I had to let you know that you are not alone and you can help your son learn to overcome his obstacles.

[Mayleng]

Ironically, my older son takes a cup of coffee with Carnation instant breakfast (vanilla) before school since he started High School. It seems most of the HS kids go to the local coffee places for coffee anyway before school. My ADDer does not drink coffee, he does not like the taste. I, on the other hand, am addicted to coffee.

[drjohnson]

Back when I was just beginning to wonder if my kids had ADHD, they were just in 2nd grade, I had read that caffeine can have a similar effect to Ritalin. The article I read even mentioned that if your kids did better after consuming caffeine, then it might be a clue. So after trying so hard to keep soda out of my house, I found myself foisting Coke and other sodas on my little ones. It did seem to have a mild positive effect, sometimes.

Then I moved on to giving them caffeine tablets in their cocoa concoctions. The literature seemed to be pretty unanimous that caffeine is pretty benign.

I've since seen it often mentioned as a good little boost to give when you don't want to give anymore Ritalin. And I have a friend who is convinced that she is an undiagnosed ADHDer. She can't drink coffee because it puts her to sleep.

[snapplema]

This reminds me when I arrived home with a big bottle of French Cognac and explained to my mom that this is what the doctor prescribed

And it was true! I had low blood pressure, not too low -but low enough to make me more sleepy in the morning. That doctor believed more in natural remedies than in chemical meds. So her advice to me was: just have a cup of coffee whenever you feel sleepy during the day and have some brandy after dinner to get you through the evening. I do like to have coffee in the morning but never liked alcohol.

I was in college at that time and I will never forget how scared my mom was to see me helping myself to a drink from the big bottle of cognac...there was no need to worry: that cognac lasted for years and I think it might still be there ;D